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Speaker: I will now call=
the
House to order. At this time, we will proceed with prayers.
Prayers
DAILY ROUTINE
Speaker: We will proceed at this time with the Order Paper.
Tributes.
TRIBUTES
In remembrance of Clifford Elmer Fisher
Hon.
Mr.
Kip was born on
Kip often related to many the story=
of their
journey from
Kip’s father pioneered the
transportation industry in the
In 1944, at 17 years of age, Kip li=
ed about
his age and flew to
In 1952, Kip married Jo Ewing of =
span>
Kip hauled fuel for his dad, who ha=
d moved
to
In 1965, Kip bought the Dairy Queen=
that he
developed into a thriving business. In 1976, Kip bought into a partnership =
in
the Taku Hotel. He was also a partner in the local Coca-Cola company in
In 2003, Kip received a lifetime
achievement award from TIA Yukon for his immeasurable contribution of suppo=
rt
and commitment to the growth and vitality of the
Those who know Kip will know and re= member that he was a very, very sensitive person. He was always willing to help th= ose in need. For 10 years he cared for Jo as she battled Alzheimer’s dise= ase, until she passed away in August of 2010.
Mr. Speaker, Kip passed away on Feb= ruary 18 of this year, and he will be sorely missed by his family and his many frien= ds, some of whom have joined us here in the Legislature this afternoon.<= /p>
INTRODUCTION OF VISITO= RS
Hon.
Mr.
Applause
In recognition of Education Week=
Hon.
Mr.
The significance of education has r= emained strong throughout the centuries and from an early time in civilization on h= as transcended into being one of the bases of our society. English writer G.K. Chesterson said, “Education is simply the soul of a society as it pas= ses from one generation to another.” Mr. Speaker, the Department of Educa= tion is not only recognizing this; it is embracing and celebrating education eve= ry year through Education Week.
I am proud to say that Yukoners tod= ay have an abundance of programs, courses and training opportunities available thro= ugh public schools, Yukon College and through our other partners in education, = all of which help prepare them for their future.
Education cannot be prescribed like medicine; it has to be offered, wanted and encouraged. Therefore, education= is a joint effort of teaching staff, students and the community.
In this same context, the receipt o= f a certificate or diploma does not mark the end of an educational process, but simply shows that the tools have been acquired to continue on the chosen pa= th. Education truly is lifelong learning.
Much has changed since the time of =
ancient
We take time in this week to celebr=
ate innovation.
Mr. Speaker, three rural schools and one high school in
While the context of education, and therefore its requirements, changed, the basic ideas remain the same. How d= o we pass on and increase the knowledge we have as a society? How do we enable future generations to contribute to our society in a meaningful way and ens= ure they are digitally literate and ethical citizens; and in doing so, how do we help sustain our economy?
Each year, Education Week features =
a series
of events to encourage our interest in learning at all ages and levels. We =
take
the opportunity to convey the message that everyone can and should be invol=
ved
in learning, and to reach out to those who don’t know or who are afra=
id
to ask about learning.
We will showcase not only the department’s work this week, but that of some of our partners in education. Displays will include everything from experiential education to apprenticeship, to First Nations programs and partnerships and information = from our partners.
Education Week informs people about= options that are available to them as learners. It lets people know that education = is an open door and that they are welcome to come in, observe, participate, ask questions and find out more.
This year the Department of Educati=
on will
be hosting an open house on April 19 from
There are numerous events scheduled= to take place over the course of the week. A few examples for me to name include the bridge-building contest that was held this past weekend at Porter Creek Secondary School; First Nation culture week at Selkirk Elementary; Promethe= an board information sessions at Christ the King Elementary School; a skills qualifier competition and alternative energy vehicle display, both at Yukon= College; the Yukon Literacy Coalition presentations at the college and the Yukon Wri= ters Festival will be hosted at several venues. I encourage all members of this House and as many members of the public as are able to participate in some = way in the Education Week activities being held across our territory from April= 16 to 20. Thank you.
Mr. Tredger:= I am pleased to= rise on behalf of the Official Opposition in this Yukon Education Week to pay tribu= te to the students, the parents, the teachers and the many other people in our territory who are involved in education.
We are most fortunate to have a very skilled, dedicated and dynamic group of educators. In this special week, we extend our gratitude to the professionals involved in the wide range of education: elementary and high school teachers, educational assistants, tut= ors, secretaries, bus drivers, college instructors, public servants, early child= hood educators and non-governmental organizations such as Yukon Learn and Skills Canada. Their commitment to lifelong education and training has a lasting effect on the future of our children and our grandchildren. These professio= nals don’t stand alone. The remarkable contributions of parents and volunt= eers who sit on school councils and boards, assist teachers in public schools wi= th extracurricular activity, who work with children and adults with special needs through vari= ous non-governmental organizations is recognized this week. We extend our heart= felt thanks to those many volunteers.
Mr. Speaker, universal free educati= on was not always a standard in our world. It is a priority now for all societies = because of the struggles of many people in the past. They believed in the bettermen= t of all by the empowerment through education and we reap the benefits of their foresight.
At any age, education plays a great= part in all our lives and sometimes we take its principles and beliefs for granted.= In my experience, all parents want the best for their children. I have yet to = meet a parent who didn’t think education was a priority. Education should embrace that commitment.
In the
Like never before, it takes a whole= community to work together. There are no simple answers. Education and learning are a= bout working together; it’s about taking risks and taking chances; it̵= 7;s about building relationships.
We have an opportunity in the
Let us celebrate the relationships,= the partnerships, the dedication of all those who have made education their pas= sion and vocation.
Mr.
Elias:=
8195; I rise today on behalf of the Liberal caucus to pay tribute to
Education Week, from April 16 to 20. Education Week is an excellent time to
focus on the importance of education and to raise the awareness of many
educational opportunities available to Yukoners. This year’s theme is
“Celebrating Innovation”. This week is an opportunity to highli=
ght
the important role education plays in shaping the future of our young people
and, in turn, our territory. Throughout the week, there are many activities=
and
events creating awareness of the education opportunities in each and every =
Also, at
Education is a lifelong learning
experience. Each child or youth is unique, and we must develop that uniquen=
ess
by giving them the essential tools, skills and 21st century
technology to help them develop their full potential. Throughout the territ=
ory
— in Pelly Crossing for instance — there’s a celebration =
of
I would be remiss if I didn’t=
mention
what is happening in my home school, the
We encourage all Yukoners to get in=
volved
and attend one of the many open houses or participate in one of the many wo=
rkshops
being held throughout the
Mr. Speaker, one of my passions is = the development and implementation of sports academies in our public education system here in the territory. They have proven to be successful in many jurisdictions around the world and have the endorsement of dozens of universities, including Harvard.
From my own experience, Mr. Speaker= , I used to live out on the Old Crow Flats from March until June, until approximately age 13. I was home-schooled in an 8x10 tent by my grandmother. When I couldn’t go, she would say, “You got to go to school now. You c= an’t come back here,” because I was entering junior high. She said, “= ;You tell those people you have a Crow Flats paper and that it has value.” Those kinds of things, from my experience, are important, and that goes to land-based experiential learning. Those types of things are important.
During Education Week we celebrate = teaching excellence and student achievement as they engage and embrace the new techn= ologies of the 21st century. Our students of today will be our leaders of tomorrow,= Mr. Speaker. They are our future. Thank you.
Speaker’s statement
Speaker: Just so you can keep your records straight — unfortunat= ely, I didn’t get the message out to everybody. We were unsuccessful in gett= ing enough applicants for the Youth Parliament, as a result of all the other activities that are going on in Education Week and all the other things stu= dents were up to. We will be trying again.
In recognition of Volunteer Week=
Hon.
Ms. Taylor: Mr. Speaker, I rise to pay tribute =
to
volunteers as people across
This year, the theme is “Volu= nteers: Passion, Action, Impact.” Yukoners, me included, recently experienced= the Arctic Winter Games and the huge impact volunteers had on the games in Marc= h. Games such as these could not have been hosted if it weren’t for the 2,000 individuals plus who donated their time and tremendous efforts in so many, various ways.
Mr. Speaker, going into it, =
Volunteers support the cultural, recreational and sporting events we attend and participate in. They keep us safe by providing emergency services and support in times of crisis. With t= he help of volunteers, we have year-round access to music, dance, film and the= atre festivals. We have bike relays, marathons, ski loppets, curling, hockey, softball, and the list goes on.
[Member spoke in French. Text unava=
ilable.]
Volunteers play a critical role in =
For the last 30 years, as an exampl=
e,
volunteers have worked tirelessly to build and develop the [Member spoke in French. Text
unavailable.] Whether they are young, whether the=
y have families,
whether they are older, are workers or retired — no matter what their=
backgrounds,
[Members spoke in French. Text
unavailable.] Mr. Speaker, volunteers also make o=
ur communities
safe. We all live better knowing that there are well-trained and equipped
volunteers to provide emergency medical services, volunteer fire departments
and search and rescue services. For all these reasons, it’s very
important to take the time during this week and all year-round to recognize=
The I’d encourage all members and=
the
public at large to attend the event as an opportunity to thank the bureau f=
or
their work and to help them celebrate. I understand that there is Volunteer
Yukon staff within the gallery today, and I invite all members of the House=
to
join me in a round of applause for Volunteer Yukon and for Applause Ms.
Stick:=
8195; On behalf of the
Official Opposition, I rise today to pay tribute to National Volunteer Week,
April 15 to 21. The contribution of volunteers generates substantial benefi=
ts
for organizations, individuals, communities and society. In Volunteerism impacts every aspect o=
f our
lives, whether it is recreation, health, education, social services, or the
arts. All of us have been or still are volunteers, whether it is for our fa=
vourite
sport, assisting our churches, in our children’s schools, working on a
council or a committee, or in dedication to a cause. Special mention and thanks should b=
e made
to our trained volunteer firefighters and ambulance attendants. They volunt=
eer
to save lives and property and are extremely important to those in <=
st1:City> There is economic value to the work=
of
volunteers as it supports our economy. All of our non-government organizati=
ons
need volunteers to help provide service. Many NGOs are managed and administ=
ered
by volunteers. Established institutions such as schools and hospitals rely =
on
volunteers as well. It is estimated that the economic value of volunteerism=
in Organizations are responding well by
offering shorter commitments, group sharing of work, references for career
building and providing valuable training for future paid work. Efforts are
being made to encourage more youth and young adults to volunteer. In the
forefront of these challenges is our own Yukon Volunteer Bureau. The Volunt=
eer
Bureau is the I am pleased to join all members in=
this
House in recognizing the energy and commitment of our Mr.
Silver:&=
#8195; I rise today on=
behalf
of the Liberal caucus to pay tribute to National Volunteer Week, April 15 to
the 21, and I extend our thanks and tribute our The 2012 National Volunteer Week th=
eme is,
as mentioned, “Volunteers: Passion, Action, Impact.” This
year’s theme highlights the vital contributions that volunteers make =
to
communities across The world of volunteerism is essent=
ial in
maintaining healthy, dynamic communities at home and around the world. This
week is about taking time to recognize the incredible contributions of Applause Speaker: Introduction of visitors. Speaker’s statement=
Speaker: Prior to tabling returns and documents, the Chair would like =
to
remind all members once again of the proper procedures regarding this item =
on
the daily routine. On Thursday, April 12, the Minister of Highways and Publ=
ic
Works tabled draft regulations on government facility use, made pursuant to=
the
Financial Administration Act. The minister prefaced the tabling of t=
he
document with certain comments. Such comments are not in order. As the Chair
informed the House on April 5, 2012, with regard to documents tabled by the
Leader of the Official Opposition, when members table documents, they are to
restrict themselves to informing the House of the title of the document and=
, if
applicable, the authority under which the document is being tabled. If the =
document
has no title, the member may offer a brief, non-political description of its
contents. I thank all members for their attention. Are there any documents or returns =
for
tabling? Are there any reports of committees=
? REPORTS OF COMMITTEES<=
o:p> Mr. Hassard: =
; I have for pres=
entation
the second report of the Standing Committee on Appointments to Major Govern=
ment
Boards and Committees. Speaker: Any there any other committee reports for presentation? Petitions. PETITIONS Petition No. 3 — response Hon.
Mr. Cathers: I rise today to respond to Petition=
No.
3, which was presented to this House on March 29. The subject of Petition N=
o. 3
was the oil and gas request for postings in the Whitehorse Trough, which was
under review recently. In responding to the petition, I wo=
uld
again note that, as I stated when the Yukon government received the request=
for
postings, the request came as a surprise, and we had not decided whether or=
not
any oil and gas rights for exploration be issued in the Whitehorse Trough a=
rea. The process for review of a request=
for
postings is set out by regulations under the Following that technical review and=
public
consultation, the government needs to decide whether to allow bids in all of
the areas, some of the areas, or none of the areas. As I indicated at the
beginning of February, all three options were being considered by the gover=
nment
and were out for both technical review and public feedback. Public consultation is now complete=
. What
we heard is that there are a lot of Yukoners who have concerns and questions
about oil and gas exploration and development in the Whitehorse Trough at t=
his
time. The government is going to consider the many questions and issues that
were raised. In the 2011 election campaign, the Yukon Party talked about oil
and gas development in north This public consultation was our fi=
rst real
opportunity to hear from Yukoners their views on the possibility of oil and=
gas
rights being issued in the Whitehorse Trough. Regulations under the In concluding my response, I want t=
o again
thank staff of Oil and Gas Resources who led public consultation for all the
work they did related to this request for postings. I want to thank other s=
taff
of Energy, Mines and Resources who participated and assisted in that proces=
s. I
thank them all for their service, both to the government and the citizens o=
f
the Speaker: Are there any petitions to be presented? Are there any bills to be introduce=
d? Are there any notices of motion? NOTICES OF MOTION Mr. Hassard: =
; I rise to give =
notice
of the following motion: THAT this House urges the Governmen=
t of
Yukon to provide land in phases 1 and 2 of the development of Whistle Bend =
subdivision
to Habitat for Humanity for the purpose of future construction with a
commitment for land for similar developments in future stages of Whistle Be=
nd. I also give notion to the following=
motion: THAT this House urges the Governmen=
t of
Yukon to establish a tax credit for parents or guardians of children involv=
ed
in music, arts or tutoring. Ms.
McLeod: I ris=
e to
give notice of the following motion: THAT this House urges the Governmen=
t of
Canada to ensure that Yukon citizens continue to have access to CBC AM Radio
and CBC TV by requiring the Canadian Broadcasting Corporation to provide AM
radio service by relocating its Whitehorse tower and continuing to broadcast
CBC Radio One on the AM 570 band, and requiring the Canadian Broadcasting
Corporation to continue to transmit CBC TV in both English and French in the
Yukon. Mr.
Tredger:=
I rise to give =
notice
of the following motion: THAT this House urges the Governmen=
t of
Yukon to fully implement all recommendations in the Auditor General’s=
January
2009 report on Public Schools and Advanced Education by the end of this fis=
cal
year. Ms.
White:=
8195; I rise to give =
notice
of the following motion: THAT in this International Voluntee=
r Week,
this House urges the Government of Canada to recognize the many benefits to
Canada and the Yukon realized through the volunteers in Katimavik by contin=
uing
to finance the organization at its current level into the future. I also give notice of the following=
motion: THAT this House urges the Mr.
Elias:=
8195; I rise to give notice of the following motion: THAT this House urges the Minister =
of
Education to undertake an official review of the department’s policy
regarding the secondary school students’ travel subsidy as it relates=
to
the isolated community of Old Crow, Yukon. Mr.
Silver:&=
#8195; I rise to give =
notice
of the following motion: THAT this House urges the Minister =
of
Health and Social Services to work toward an expedient, thoughtful and endu=
ring
resolution to the labour issues at Many Rivers Counselling and Support Serv=
ices
Society so that the organization may return to its important work, particul=
arly
in light of limited mental health services currently available in rural Yuk=
on
communities. Speaker: Is there a statement by a minister? This brings us to Question Period. =
QUESTION PERIOD Question re:
Peel watershed land use plan Ms. Hanson:=
Prior to and du=
ring the
election, the Premier said that it would be irresponsible to express any op=
inion
on the recommended Peel land use plan before community consultations began.
After the election, the Minister of Energy, Mines and Resources repeatedly =
told
this House that the Yukon Party government wants to take a different plan to
the public for consultation and we all saw the government’s ads. In addition, the minister responsib=
le has
told this House on numerous occasions the North Yukon Regional Land Use =
Plan
is the template that the Yukon Party is looking for — an approach tha=
t is
completely at odds with the unique nature of the Hon.
Mr. Cathers: It’s very interesting to hear=
the
statements made by the Leader of the Official Opposition. She is once again
coming forward to the House with information that does not accurately refle=
ct
the facts. I would again remind the member what we in fact said in the elec=
tion
campaign. We criticized the proposed plan. The Premier was critical, the Yu=
kon
Party was critical of the Leader of the NDP and the Leader of the Liberal P=
arty
for supporting the plan and we talked about our commitment to seek a final =
plan
that protects the environment and respects all sectors of the economy. In fact, what I have indicated prev=
iously
to the House — and will again indicate — is one of the suggesti=
ons
that we are making is that we believe that some of the work contained within
the North Yukon Regional Land Use Plan may be a better model. We think that the North Yukon plann=
ing
commission did an excellent job on the work that they did and while emphasi=
zing
the fact that we appreciate what the Peel Watershed Planning Commission did=
in
their review and in their proposed plan, we also, in proceeding forward with
the final stages, have to recognize that where there may be room for
improvement, it is government’s obligation to propose modifications it
believes would be improvements and to seek public feedback on that. Again, =
we
have, and will continue, to follow the final agreements and the process laid
out under the Umbrella Final Agreem=
ent
with First Nations. Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; Mr. Speaker, la=
st week,
Yukoners were pleased to see the Yukon Party government respond in a positi=
ve
way to their legitimate concerns about the oil and gas dispositions. Public
consultations are meant to allow dialogue and the expression of options, not
closed conversations stating one party’s political line. Now, we̵=
7;ve
got the Premier admitting, and I quote: “What I’m saying is tha=
t we
had a position on the Peel and we didn’t have a position on oil and
gas.” So first the Yukon Party didn’=
;t have
a position; then they did; then they didn’t; now they do. Mr. Speaker,
Yukoners expect the government to be forthright. My question is therefore q=
uite
simple: Will this government guarantee that the final public consultation on
the Peel plan will include the recommended Peel land use plan as written by=
the
commission? Hon.
Mr. Cathers: Again, what we have once again befo=
re the
House is not only the Leader of the NDP coming up with, at best, cherry-pic=
king
elements from history and, at times, coming forward with information that is
simply not reflective of the facts, but the fact that I would point out the=
NDP
spent most of the last couple of months telling Yukoners that the Yukon
government was pushing for oil and gas exploration in the Whitehorse Trough
when that was absolutely incorrect and not factual. Again, as the Premier noted the oth=
er day,
the Yukon Party did have a position on the Peel watershed plan, as I indica=
ted
both in my response to the petition and in announcing that we were not goin=
g to
proceed with disposition of oil and gas rights in the Whitehorse Trough are=
a at
this point in time. We did not have a position on the Whitehorse Trough. We=
had
talked about oil and gas development in north So, again, Mr. Speaker, contrary to=
what
the Leader of the NDP likes to say, we do follow the public consultation
process, and we will continue to do so. We will also continue to reflect our
election commitments and follow those and honour those. Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; It is becoming
abundantly clear that the Yukon Party government does not like the
democratically developed recommended Peel land use plan. The land use commi=
ssion
established by the First Nation final agreements had people appointed by bo=
th
First Nation governments and the Hon.
Mr. Cathers: Again, another example of the Leade=
r of
the NDP not reflecting the facts. The Leader of the NDP just stood here and
said that the government did not make its views known earlier. I would point
out to the member opposite that as early as 2006, the Yukon government
encouraged the Peel Watershed Planning Commission to look at the plan devel=
oped
by the North Yukon Planning Commission and identified that we believed some=
of
the mechanisms and tools within that plan represented a better approach for
managing the Peel area than what the commission came up with. So again, that
was six years ago. The Again, as I mentioned to the member
opposite, one of the reasons that we believe that some lessons can be learn=
ed
from the North Yukon Regional Land Use Plan is that that plan manages
the environmental footprints from all users, from all industries in a fair =
and
equitable manner, and we commend the commission for the work they did in th=
at.
We will again continue to follow our obligations under chapter 11 of the fi=
nal
agreements in concluding the remaining stages of the Peel planning process.=
Question re: Oil and G=
as Act
review Mr.
Tredger:=
I would like to=
thank
all Yukoners for their involvement in the recent oil and gas disposition
review. This is an example of democracy in action where the importance of e=
ach
voice was heard loud and clear, and I would like to thank the minister oppo=
site
for having the courage to listen to Yukoners. Now this government has an
incredible opportunity. The government has noted during the=
oil and
gas public review that they wish there had been this level of interest when=
the
Oil and Gas Act amendments were undertaken in the summer of 2009. The
public is fully engaged, so now is the time for further public input and in=
volvement. Now that the opportunity is here, w=
ill the
Minister of Energy, Mines and Resources begin a public dialogue and review =
of
the Oil and Gas Act, its regulations and processes? Hon.
Mr. Cathers: Again, as I have indicated to the M=
ember
for Mayo-Tatchun before in past Question Periods in this Assembly, in fact,=
we
are reviewing the regulations under the Oil and Gas Act and determin=
ing
where there may be some improvements that can be made. That work is being d=
one
right now by officials. Of course, a significant amount of time and resourc=
es recently
within that branch — due to its limited size — was spent on
managing the recent review of the request for oil and gas postings in the
Whitehorse Trough area. Now that that process is concluded and there are not
going to be any dispositions in the Whitehorse Trough at this time, further
review of the oil and gas regulations will take place. Mr.
Tredger:=
Mr. Speaker, the
minister says he was surprised by a request to explore for oil and gas in t=
he
Whitehorse Trough. He’s surprised? Now I am concerned. The Yukon Party
government has spent thousands of public dollars over many years on trips t=
o The Premier said they had no plan, =
so they
listened to the public. We are flying by the seat of our pants. This is our=
backyard,
our home, our wilderness and our life. Will the minister show leadership on
this file, fully engage the public in an open process about the development=
of
oil and gas in the Hon.
Mr. Cathers: Out of that last little speech by t=
he
Member for Mayo-Tatchun, the only thing that I agree with is that the NDP is
flying by the seat of their pants. I would point out in this that the member
has made some fairly significant assertions about government’s approa=
ch
that really do not line up with the facts. The Government has not, certainl=
y at
a political level, to the best of my knowledge, at any point in time —=
; I
know that I certainly have never gone out and encouraged the oil and gas
industry to consider the Whitehorse Trough, which the member seemed to be
asserting was the case. We have talked about and the Yukon Party, as a part=
y,
committed to our support for responsible gas development in the belief that=
the
Eagle Plains area and Again, what we have talked about is
responsible resource management, including responsible economic opportuniti=
es.
I believe my time is running out in this response, so I look forward to hea=
ring
what will come in the next question from the NDP. Mr.
Tredger:=
The minister sa=
ys he
was surprised by the request for disposition. Again, I say,
“surprised”? That is not the response Yukoners were hoping for.
Fortunately, Yukoners spoke and the Cathers-Pasloski government came to the=
ir
senses. Where is the strategy? Really, all I am asking is something quite
simple: let us engage with all concerned parties — First Nation
governments, with all Yukoners — and begin an open and public process
about how we as Yukoners will use and develop our territory’s oil and=
gas
deposits — not behind closed doors, but open and public. Now will the minister seize the opp=
ortunity
presented to him, begin a very public engagement on oil and gas in the terr=
itory
and move forward on land use planning? Hon.
Mr. Cathers: Mr. Speaker, I thought that you mig=
ht be
reminding the member not to refer to members by name, no matter how humorous
that might be. Again, what I would point out in re=
sponse
to the member’s comments — some of the level of rhetoric that t=
he
NDP has engaged in on this oil and gas request we’re posting, the ass=
ertions
they’ve made, the claims they’ve made have really, to some exte=
nt,
led to fears, concerns and misconceptions by members of the Yukon public th=
at
really are not helpful at this stage. As I have mentioned to members, we =
took the
input from Yukoners who had concerns, fears and, in some cases, simply a la=
ck
of support for oil and gas development in the Whitehorse Trough at this tim=
e.
We provided the opportunity for them to give us their comments, and we did
listen to those comments. We made a decision that is reflective of what we
heard from As far as the Oil and Gas Act goes, and what I have to remind the member of, =
is
in fact, there was fully open consultation under the Oil and Gas Act related to potential changes in the past. If we
make changes to regulations in the future, I anticipate that there will be
further public consultation, and we do intend, as I have stated before in t=
his
House, to provide more information to citizens as oil and gas development in
north I believe I’m out of time at =
this
point, but we will continue to engage with the public. Question re: Mr.
Elias:=
8195; It’s Education Week. Many Yukoners know what the power =
of
sport does for their children and how sports contribute to a healthy commun=
ity,
building solid citizens and the direct relationship between academic
achievement and the participation in the game of hockey and other sports. T=
he Is the Minister of Education famili=
ar with
this type of program? Hon.
Mr. Mr.
Elias:=
8195; Well, that’s a positive note, Mr. Speaker. The main pre=
mise
of the idea is to get the student’s heart rate up to a certain level =
for
a certain period of time in the morning. Then they go to school and learn
mainly academics in the afternoon. The important aspect here is also to make
efficient use of our arena facilities during school day hours throughout th=
e Will the Minister of Education exer=
cise his
authority under section 6(1)(b) of the Education Act and give the gr=
een
light for the implementation of a Hon.
Mr. There are a number of other program=
s. While
I respect the fact the member opposite is referring specifically to hockey,=
I
think we can look beyond just hockey, Mr. Speaker; I think we can look to
cycling, to cross-country skiing, to figure skating, to swimming. I know th=
e Premier’s
daughters are — or one of his daughters, for sure — is attending
university in the Mr.
Elias:=
8195; I will get to the reason I am advocating for the hockey acade=
my,
but it is also important to note that this is not for elite athletes. It is=
for
kids with all skill levels. This type of sports program has been proven to =
work
in many jurisdictions, and it doesn’t have to be just hockey. There is
swimming, skiing, running, cycling, soccer and many other sports that are u=
sed
in these programs, as the minister said; however, I am advocating for a hoc=
key
program as a beginning, because the academies and the curriculum are already
set up and established elsewhere. I actually attended one of these sports p=
rograms
in Victoria, B.C. recently and the parents spoke very highly of it. In our
territory we have issues with attendance; we have issues with graduation ra=
tes;
we have issues with success in academics between rural Will the minister support the set u=
p and
the implementation of Hon.
Mr. Kent: With respect to the fact that there=
are
models out there regarding hockey and the hockey academy — as I menti=
oned
in my first answer, my nephew also attended a sports high school where he w=
as a
downhill skier. So there are models beyond just hockey that exist in other
jurisdictions. Of course some of the programs that we offer here in the Yuk=
on
currently, such as the CHAOS 9 program, the experiential learning programs =
of
Wood Street Annex, also a fashion, arts and design program at Porter Creek =
—
and I know that the Member for Vuntut Gwitchin asked my predecessor about t=
his
very matter — I believe it was in 2009. At that time the previous
minister mentioned the experiential education program, the land-based learn=
ing
in Old Crow which has been a tremendous success, one referenced by the Chie=
f of
the Vuntut Gwitchin First Nation at the Yukon Forum that I was able to atte=
nd
last Friday. While I cannot make that specific
commitment to set up that pilot project right now, I will make that commitm=
ent
to work with sports governing bodies, and parents and teachers to look for a
model that will work here in the Question re: Mental health
services for youth Mr. Silver: Members of this House rose earlier =
to
tribute Education Week. Students and educators will be taking part in
activities this week to celebrate success in Hon.
Mr. Kent: Just to respond to that question, n=
ot
only on the Minister of Health and Social Services’ behalf, but as
Minister of Education: As most members will know, when it comes to issues of
learning and mental health, there are transition times from preschool to
kindergarten and then throughout the elementary school and then, of course,
graduating high school and beyond. So this will be something that I can bri=
ng
up with the Minister of Health and Social Services to address the question =
from
the Member for Mr. Silver: Last year=
, the
Child and Youth Advocate brought to light that there is no legal framework =
for
youth mental health services. Without governing legislation, he warned,
children’s needs are subject to being ignored, existing services are =
used
improperly, and the system lacks accountability. The Health and Social Serv=
ices
minister at the time acknowledged this gap, but said that there were many o=
ther
areas which required the government’s attention. Has the new Minister of Health and =
Social
Services reviewed the legal framework for youth mental health, and will he =
be
following the advocate’s recommendation to develop such legislation?<=
/span> Hon.
Mr. Cathers: I will have to defer some parts of =
that
answer to the Minister of Health and Social Services to respond to the memb=
er
and get back him at a later date with specifics. What I would point out to the membe=
r is
that in fact this government has taken significant steps to expand mental
health, including specifically providing a youth clinician. We have expanded
the services in rural As far as some of the specifics, in
response to the Member for Klondike, we’ll have to commit to getting =
back
to him at a later date or rather I will ask the Minister of Health and Soci=
al
Services to get back to the Member for Klondike. Mr.
Silver:&=
#8195; Families with c=
hildren
with mental health issues face significant challenges. If their children
don’t receive the support and services they need, they are unlikely t=
o do
so well at school. They will miss out on opportunities to develop key skills
for further education, for careers and for taking part in our communities.
Parents tell us that they have to fight for services and that bureaucratic
obstacles add greatly to the already significant challenges of raising a ch=
ild
with mental health issues. Moreover, disenfranchised families may lack
knowledge and resources to advocate for their children within the mental he=
alth
system. What can the acting minister do to =
better
help parents navigate the system and access services that these children ne=
ed? Hon.
Mr. With respect to a guide that the me=
mber
opposite spoke about, it’s something that came up for me recently at =
the
Whitehorse Elementary School Council meeting that I attended last week. I c=
an
let the Member for Klondike know that the Department of Education, through =
our
special programs advisory committee, is working on setting up a resource to
help parents navigate the school system — parents of children with
special needs, whether it’s mental health needs or otherwise. I hope =
that
that can be ready soon for presentation to parents to, again, help them
navigate through the education system. Question re: Climate chan=
ge Ms.
White:=
8195; Tackling climat=
e change
is arguably the biggest, most important challenge we face as a human specie=
s. Despite
the growth of our knowledge of climate change, real action has been elusive=
. We
know we can’t continue our fossil fuel addiction. It’s a suicid=
al
path. But collectively, we’re just not getting off the path quick eno=
ugh.
The Hon.
Mr. Dixon: To answer the member opposite’=
;s
question, the way that climate change is being instilled in the mind of gov=
ernment
is through the development of the Climate Change Secretariat. That secretariat was developed by t=
he
previous Yukon Party government and was really tasked with making sure the
government, throughout the departments, is aware of its actions related to
climate change and ensuring that government practices, both in terms of its=
own
practices, as well as its procurement — procured services and products
— all reflect Yukon’s commitment to combating climate change. <=
/span> Ms.
White:=
8195; In the north, w=
e have
been responsible for very few historic greenhouse gas emissions, but this c=
ould
change. Scientists say that massive amounts of greenhouse gases trapped bel=
ow
thawing permafrost will likely seep into the air over the next several deca=
des
and will speed up climate change. Permafrost experts have said that the rel=
ease
of heat-trapping gases under the frozen ground may be a bigger factor in
climate change than the cutting down of forests. This scenario is of global
concern. It’s also of local concern in terms of impacts on our
infrastructure. We know the Department of Highways and Public Works has
completed a three-year vulnerability assessment of government buildings in =
the
areas where permafrost is thawing. Can the Minister of Highways and Pu=
blic
Works share with this House some details about his department’s
assessment on the thawing permafrost and our infrastructure, and will he ta=
ble
the reports? Hon.
Mr. Dixon: In terms of the specific project co=
nducted
by the Department of Highways and Public Works, I don’t have the deta=
ils
at hand. But I can say that the website www.perm=
afrost.gov.yk.ca
does have a significant amount of information about Adapting to climate change is one o=
f the
goals of our Climate Change Action Plan. That is indeed being reflec=
ted
in the number of actions that are being taken by a variety of departments of
government. A number of those activities are available on-line, and I encou=
rage
the member opposite to review those. Ms.
White:=
8195; The major global
insurer, Lloyd’s of London, recently weighed in on the risks and
opportunities developing in a rapidly changing north. Lloyd’s says
development is expected to reach $100 billion over the next decade but that
“sustainable realisation of the economic opportunities that result fr=
om
these developments depends on strong, regulatory frameworks and corporate
environmental stewardship”. Lloyd’s says that there are a lot of
uncertainties, knowledge gaps and infrastructure vulnerabilities in the nor=
th
that add risk when undertaking significant industrial activity. Can the government explain how risk
management, in the context of climate change, is guiding the governmentR=
17;s
decision-making on industrial development? Hon.
Mr. Dixon: The first goal of the Investments like that build our und=
erstanding
of climate change and climate change science, which allows us to make decis=
ions
about development in the north. Speaker: The time for Question Period has now elapsed. We will proceed=
with
Orders of the Day. ORDERS OF THE DAY Hon.
Mr. Cathers: Mr. Speaker, I move that the Speake=
r do
now leave the Chair and that the House resolve into Committee of the Whole.=
Speaker: It has been moved by the Government House Leader that the Spe=
aker
do now leave the Chair and that the House resolve into Committee of the Who=
le. Motion agreed to Speaker leaves the Chair COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE=
Chair
(Ms. McLeod): Order please. Com=
mittee
of the Whole will now come to order. The matter before the Committee is Bill
No. 40, Act to Amend the Financial Administration Act. Do members wi=
sh
to take a 15-minute recess? All
Hon. Members: Agreed. Chair: Committee of the Whole is recessed for 15 minutes. Recess Chair: Order. Committee of the Whole will now come to order.<=
/p>
Bill No. 40: Act to Amend the
Financial Administration Act — continued Chair: The matter before the Committee is Bill No. 40, Act to Ame=
nd the
Financial Administration Act. We are resuming general debate on Bill No.
40. Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: I’d like to thank our support=
from
the departments for coming here today. The Act to Amend the Financial
Administration Act provision regarding public property — its purp=
ose
is to help the government balance two important responsibilities. These are=
the
responsibility to support people’s exercise of democratic rights and =
fundamental
freedoms and the responsibility to keep public facilities safe and accessib=
le
to all. All Canadians and certainly all Yuk=
oners
treasure the rights and freedoms we enjoy. As part of that, Yukoners expect=
to
be able to use public spaces when and how they choose. Among other things, =
they
want to be able to make their views heard in a public forum. Peaceful demon=
strations,
protests, gatherings and marches are all part of our Canadian and As a responsible government, we tak=
e both
of these kinds of expectations seriously. We respect and indeed celebrate <=
/span> Even if we may not agree with
someone’s views, we will never use our disagreement as an excuse to k=
eep
discussion or debate out of our public spaces. We also accept, however, that
there are limits on the exercise of any freedom. Nobody can be allowed to s=
hout
down other voices in the name of free expression, for example; nor does the
freedom of association mean that some people have more rights than others to
occupy and use the property that we all own together. We are committed, in
short, to keeping Usually, maintaining these two comm=
itments
is easy. Day in and day out, Yukon Parks, public buildings, other facilities
see all kinds of use by all kinds of people with no difficulty whatsoever. =
Occasionally, though, the governmen=
t needs
to be able to ensure that limits are respected. Not everything that purport=
s to
be a peaceful demonstration really is. Sometimes actions of a small group,
however well-intentioned, can impose disproportionate costs on the communit=
y.
When health and safety is at stake, when serious property damage results, or
when public spaces cease to be usable for their intended purpose, the gover=
nment
has a duty to act. Last year, Yukoners were given a ve=
ry
direct insight into the difficulty balancing government responsibilities. A
number of people set up camp in an area that included some government-owned
land and some privately owned land. There seemed to have been a variety of
reasons for the encampment and I do not propose at this time to engage in a
debate about its social or political significance. What I want to emphasize is that the
situation presented the government with a very real difficulty. I was just
elected and this became quite evident to me. From the start, the government
respected the full rights of the protestors to make their voices heard. More
than that, the government officials worked hard to understand and, where
possible, respond to the specific pressing needs that some of the protestors
had. Over time, it became apparent that =
the
encampment was not only moving beyond its initial purpose as a form of expr=
ession,
but was also creating some significant risks for the campers themselves, for
other members of the community and, it must be said, for the government as =
the
owner of the property. The ongoing occupation of a significant public space=
by
this one group, of course, denied the use of space to everyone else.=
For those reasons, it eventually be=
came
necessary for the government to ask the campers to move on. At that point,
though, we confronted the fact that the Other jurisdictions do have more la=
ws in
this regard. In all of The federal regulation applies to
Government of Canada buildings and other properties, including such importa=
nt
public spaces as, of course, Parliament Hill. It does not in any way interf=
ere
with peaceful protests and demonstrations, but it does prohibit the kind of
actions that I think most Canadians would agree are not appropriate use of
public facilities, such as defacing buildings, interfering with traffic con=
trol
signs and devices, and committing a nuisance. The federal regulation also p=
rohibits
erecting unauthorized structures on public works, camping where it is not
permitted and occupying public works. It allows the federal minister to req=
uire
someone who is doing these things to leave the property. This is not some heavy-handed attem=
pt by Doing so is being part of a respons=
ible
government, not some kind of conspiracy against free speech. The federal re=
gulation
is a tool that helps the Government of Canada manage public properties in a
balanced way for all and for the good of all the public. Having received the
options, this government has concluded that The bill we introduced last week is=
a first
step forward. Actually, we introduced it at the beginning of the sitting. T=
he
legislation amends the Financial
Administration Act to allow the Commissioner in Executive Council to ma=
ke
regulations governing the management, maintenance, proper use and protectio=
n of
public property. The legislation goes on to allow such a regulation to assi=
st
powers and duties to any minister. This is because although the Minister of
Finance is responsible for the FAA, the Financial
Administration Act, most of the day-to-day management of public facilit=
ies
is done under my portfolio, the Minister of Highways and Public Works. The =
legislation
allows the regulations to provide for the sub-delegation of those powers and
duties. To ensure that there are appropriate
sanctions for the misuse of public properties, the legislation allows offen=
ces
to be created in a regulation. Of course, we tabled the regulations. Merely
providing for making the regulations does not by itself put any substantive
rules into the law. Those rules will be in the regulation. Before agreeing =
to
these amendments to the act, people will naturally want to know what the
government intends for the regulation. To answer that question, we tabled t=
he
regulations last week to ensure there’s a transparency in this proces=
s. I
look forward to a debate on this important amendment today. Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; I thank the min=
ister
opposite for his comments. They expand a little bit on where we left off la=
st
week, and I’ll come back to that in a moment. I want to be clear that=
the
Official Opposition doesn’t want to see Yukoners — the homeless=
and
job-seekers who can’t afford the high cost of rent — sleeping on
the grounds of the Legislative Assembly. I said that last week and I repeat=
it
again today because it’s important. That’s not the reason why w=
e do
not support this legislation. What we’ve seen is that having done not=
hing
to address the housing crisis, these amendments to the Financial Administration Act are really a cruel response. To
suggest as the minister did on Thursday that tent city residents were just =
interested
in free camping is insulting and really out of touch. It was a Marie Antoin=
ette
moment for the minister. We are all concerned that the measures — Some
Hon. Member: (Inaudible)=
Point of order Chair: Mr. Cathers, on a point of order. Hon.
Mr. Cathers: It seems to me that both the Leader=
of
the NDP’s use of the term “cruel” in response to actions
taken by government and reference to a member of this House —
characterizing response by any member of this House as a “Marie Antoi=
nette
moment” in reference, presumably, to her infamous quote, is contrary =
to
the practices of this Assembly and is likely to lead to discord. I would ask
you to have the member refrain from using that type of language. Chair: Ms. Hanson, on the point of order. Ms. Hanson: ̳=
4; There is no point of order. It is j=
ust simply
a dispute between, obviously, this member and me. Chair’s ruling Chair: There is no point of order. This is a dispute between members=
. Ms.
Hanson: Thank you, Madam Chair. We are also
concerned that the measures don’t merely apply to the homeless, but to
all Yukoners in how they could restrict our democratic rights. We are conce=
rned
that there could be Charter challenges to this legislation and the r=
egulations
that flow from it. We wonder also why the Yukon Party government is in such=
a
rush to pass this. Our efforts to meet with the minister were rebuffed. We
wanted to talk to him about slowing down and going out for public consultat=
ion
on this. We wanted to remind him about how Yukoners have not liked and have
reacted to similar kinds of legislation proposed by the Yukon Party in the =
past
— legislation that would limit civic liberties of Yukoners. As I had
said, we will not be supporting ramming through this legislation, and not
without public consultation. I’d like to go back to last w=
eek.
We’ve said quite clearly that there should be a full public consultat=
ion
on these amendments. Our position is that, until there is such a consultati=
on,
the bill should not be passed. On Thursday — and I’ll =
quote
— the minister said, “Providing these draft regulations —=
in
the spirit and intent of good comradeship here in the House — itself =
is
debate and public consultation.” That’s not true. Public
consultation is much more and I simply refer the members opposite and the
minister to the definition of “consult” or “consultation&=
#8221;.
It’s a definition that we’ve all agreed to in the context of
working with First Nation governments and it’s a generally applied
definition. Consult, or consultation, means to =
provide:
(a) to the party to be consulted, notice of a matter to be decided in
sufficient form and detail to allow that party to prepare its views on the
matter; (b) a reasonable period of time in which the party to be consulted =
may
prepare its views on the matter and an opportunity to present such views to=
the
party obliged to consult — in this case the government; and (c) full =
and
fair consideration by the party obliged to consult on any views presented.<=
/span> When I say that simply bringing for=
ward the
regulations on the day that the legislation is brought forward for debate
isn’t full and adequate consultation, I mean it. It’s not full =
and
adequate consultation. It has not engaged the public and that’s what
we’re talking about when we talk about consultation. We are talking about respecting the=
rights
of Yukoners to be involved in the conversation about proposed legislation a=
nd
regulations that will clearly have an impact on them. I’m not sure if we’re g=
oing to
be going back and forth — and I prefer to do that, rather than stand =
for
20 minutes at a time; I realize that’s a possibility — but it w=
ould
be more productive, in my mind, to raise a number of substantive questions.=
If
we could do that, that would be great. In that vein, I would like to ask t=
he
minister a few questions with respect to the various elements of the draft
regulation. In terms of the actual amendment itself, this amendment enables=
the
government to expand the power of the ministers to make regulations respect=
ing:
“(a) the management, maintenance…” and then it says the
“…proper use and protection of public property.” <=
/p>
I don’t see anywhere a defini=
tion of
“proper use”, and how is “proper use” defined? I wo=
uld
most appreciate it if the minister could explain that. Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: The use in keeping with the purpose=
of
the facility — it is from the federal regulations and mimics it. They=
did
a lot of looking into it and that is why we used that — we mimicked t=
he
federal legislation. Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; I can respect t=
hat. I
can understand that. Since we are not talking about a piece of federal
legislation, but about an amendment to a territorial Financial
Administration Act, I am still asking for a definition of “proper
use”. Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: The words “proper use” =
are in
keeping with the purpose of the facility. “Proper use”: in keep=
ing
with the purpose of the facility. Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; I think we̵=
7;ll
find, and I think the government will find, that other jurisdictions have f=
ound
that to be quite a tricky one to actually put into effect, but we’ll =
go
on. In the Q and As that were provided,=
again,
sort of mid-afternoon when this was tabled — the Q and As on the draft
regulations — there is a question about what the purpose of this
regulation is. I’ll just state what the minister did last week —
that the purpose of this regulation is to balance two responsibilities R=
12;
the responsibility to safeguard the exercise of citizens’ democratic
rights and fundamental freedoms and the responsibility to keep public
facilities safe. Now, my question for the minister: =
If the
key purpose of this regulation and the amendment to this act is to ensure t=
he
safeguarding of the exercise of citizens’ democratic rights and
fundamental freedoms, why is the public not part of the discussion on their
democratic rights, and when is the public consultation to occur? Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: The regulation respects the Charter and ensures that we consid=
er
several factors when deciding whether to deal with this particular situatio=
n. These provisions do not require an =
action.
They allow for action only if we determine there is a risk to the public sa=
fety
and to our institutions. These amendments and this regulation are designed =
to
ensure thoughtful review of the factors on a case-by-case basis before we a=
ct.
These measures provide us with the tools to act if action is required. We
tabled in the Legislative Assembly — during the first five days of th=
is
sitting, I spoke to public consultation being debate in here with elected
officials. Most of the time, we don’t even table the regulations. We =
just
pass legislation. So, the opposition party did not read the legislation unt=
il
last week. It has been publicly available since the beginning of the sittin=
g. I
believe, and this government believes, public consultation is being done as=
we
speak today. Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; I would suggest=
that
the minister may want to carefully reconsider his last words there. The
Official Opposition did, in fact, repeatedly request briefings on all of the
pieces of legislation and the amendments to that legislation. We repeatedly
asked to have those briefings to ensure that we had understood in a
comprehensive way the intention of these amendments and, in this case, the
regulations. So it is untrue — and I am sa=
ying
this advisedly — to suggest otherwise. And secondly, he has not addre=
ssed
the issue of public consultation. When will the public be able to be consul=
ted
on proposed legislation? And the second part of that: What will be the test=
of
fairness that he describes in terms of — we are asking people to acce=
pt
that some unnamed entities, perhaps it is the minister, will be making the
ultimate judgment test as to whether the decisions taken with respect to th=
e implementation
of any aspect of these regulations is fair. Could he explain that, please?<=
/span> Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: We did table the legislation within=
the
first five days of sitting. We did not take the draft regulations out until
they were complete. Most of the time, we did not even put the regulations o=
ut.
That is why they are here today. Yukoners expect the government to m=
aintain
the integrity of our public institutions. That is to ensure that our govern=
ment
facilities are well-managed and accessible to everyone, and to take our
responsibilities for the safety and security of our citizens very seriously.
These minor amendments allow us to manage what happens at our public facili=
ty
when something comes up that might need to be managed and to ensure the hea=
lth
and safety of everyone at these facilities. Yukoners gave us a very clear
mandate just a few months ago, and we take these responsibilities very
seriously. Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; So, all right; =
we
didn’t get an answer. The minister opposite is speaking to the issue =
of
the regulations that he tabled last week. The issue really is, as he said, =
the
tabling of the amendments within the first five days, the proposed amendmen=
ts
to legislation. That is what the Official Opposition asked for a briefing o=
n,
not as-yet-at-that-time unknown regulations. So let’s be clear about =
what
we are talking about when we are having a discussion or a debate. Let’=
;s
talk about the same thing; it would be very helpful. Last week the minister went on at g=
reat
length with sort of, I would suggest, the most extreme language with respec=
t to
why the regulations are necessary. Without repeating all that he went throu=
gh
last week, it struck me that there are other laws that address the problems
that he was identifying — suggesting perhaps the Criminal Code=
and
the Public Health and Safety Act. Is the issue really the need for n=
ew
regulations or is the issue the enforcement of existing legislation? You kn=
ow,
it is kind of ironic because Conservatives usually talk about cutting red t=
ape
and here they are talking about making a new enforcement layer. I would be
interested in knowing what is the issue here. Does the government have a difficul=
ty in
terms of working with existing laws and the Criminal Code — if
they are criminal acts that they see occurring on government facilities or =
Public
Health and Safety Act enforcement? It’s unclear from what the min=
ister
has said to date. Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: Our government has the clear
responsibility to manage our public facilities. In fact, every other govern=
ment
in Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; The stated inte=
nt of
the government is to see these regulations come into effect, according to t=
he Q
and As in spring of 2012. So my question then is: Why is the government so
intent on ramming through the amendments to the legislation and passing the
regulations? We have raised a number of questions about how these changes c=
ould
infringe on Yukoners’ rights to public space, so what is the motivati=
on
for ramming this through? Is this about preventing tent city?=
About
removing from public view the clearest symbol of this government’s
failure to address the housing crisis? Is this about cleaning up the downto=
wn
for the tourist season? We’re curious. Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: Like I said before, Yukoners expect=
the
government to maintain the integrity of our public institutions and to ensu=
re
that our government facilities are well-managed and accessible to everyone =
and
to take our responsibilities for the safety and security of our citizens ve=
ry
seriously. There were issues last year. These minor amendments allow us to
manage serious issues that I alluded to and spoke to last week — what
happens at our public facilities and to ensure that the health and safety of
everyone at these facilities, so all Yukoners can enjoy our public spaces.<=
/span> Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; With respect to=
the
question of whether or not this amendment to the legislation and the
regulations will affect people’s freedom to assemble on government
property, the language in the Q and As is fairly anodyne, so it sort of sou=
nds
like it won’t. But that doesn’t seem to jibe with — and i=
f it
is, again, we wonder why they haven’t consulted with Yukoners. They
clearly haven’t consulted with those working with the homeless or
hard-to-house or job seekers who can’t afford the high rents. But, I
guess, since they don’t want to consult with ordinary Yukoners, perha=
ps
they could tell this House the extent to which they have done at least a sc=
an
of the civil liberties interpretations or analysis of this legislation or
similar legislation and regulations similar to it. Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: That was considered during the draf=
ting
of this by our very competent staff we have within the Government of Yukon.=
Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; Could the minis=
ter
elaborate on the extent of the civil liberties scan of this legislation and
regulation? Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: From my team: This is based on thor=
ough
analysis of the relevant case law within Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; Last week I men=
tioned
to the minister that I — not having access to a field of lawyers or
support — did my own sort of review of several seem-to-be relevant co=
urt
decisions. I thought I would share with you a little bit of my findings, be=
cause
they do cause me some concern when I look at the proposed regulations and t=
he
amendments to the legislation. I think that it’s worthwhile raising t=
hem
in the debate here today, because I think we need to be having an open mind=
to
what’s being proposed here and also perhaps the unintentional
consequences of ramming this through without broader discussion. The first one that came when we wer=
e doing
some research, and then followed up a little bit more this weekend, is the =
B.C.
Court of Appeal. This decision was a City of This decision dealt with section 7 =
of the Charter,
which as you’ll recall, says that everyone has the right to life, lib=
erty
and security of the person and the right not to be deprived thereof except =
in
accordance with the principles of fundamental justice. So, in a nutshell, w=
hat
the verdict in this case said was that the city’s bans on shelter in
public parks were unconstitutional as they violated section 7 of the Cha=
rter,
“insofar and only insofar as they apply to prevent homeless people fr=
om
erecting temporary, overnight shelter in parks when the number of homeless
people exceeds the number of available shelter beds in the City of
Victoria”. So we have no available homeless sh=
elters
beyond the Salvation Army. We often know that there are people sleeping on =
mats
and in chairs. My question for the minister is: How will the law and regula=
tion
reflect the legal precedent in the City of Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: Although we are in the preliminary =
stage,
operational policies are being drafted. We are working on the implementation
component on this regulation. The regulation respects the Charter. H=
ypothetical
from across the floor — there is hypothetical out there every day, ok=
ay.
It ensures we consider several factors when deciding whether to deal with a
particular situation. These provisions do not require an action. They allow=
for
action only if we determine that there is a risk to public safety and to ou=
r institutions.
This amendment to the act is not about housing or homelessness. Like I just
said, it’s about risk to public safety and to our institutions. Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; We’re not=
talking
hypothetical here, we are talking case law and the minister may be taking h=
is
advice from his colleague below him there, but it’s not hypothetical =
and
I would like to clarify that. In fact, the courts have found R=
12; to
simply say, “Trust us, we won’t do it unless there’s
something bad going on” — well, earlier I asked him to define w=
hat “proper
use” was. I asked him if he could define for us how and who would make
this decision. We didn’t get that information, so “trust usR=
21;
isn’t going to carry that much weight. My question: when there is no room =
at the
Sally Ann — I use the common reference to the Salvation Army and by no
means am I intending to diminish the importance of the good work by the fol=
ks
we have all worked with over the years — but when there is no room at=
the
Salvation Army — and we have heard this is often the case with people
forced to sleep in chairs and on the floor — will the minister permit
temporary shelter on public property, like on the grounds of the Legislative
Assembly? This goes back to the proper use or use question that I was tryin=
g to
get at earlier. Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: Last summer, a number of departments
within the government worked with those requiring assistance to find
alternative places to stay. They were offered alternative places to stay; t=
hey
would not accept them. It is not accurate that they had no options. We offe=
red
assisted-living apartments, social housing. We offered to pay for campsites; w=
e paid
for campsites — and you heard me talk about that — at Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; The minister fa=
lls into
the trap too easily of extrapolating from individual examples to the larger
representative group there and I know that it is an easy one to fall into. I
will not fault him for it. It is factually incorrect. You know, by prohibiting tent city =
and
doing nothing to address the housing crisis, the government is pushing the =
homeless
into spaces that might be more dangerous and less safe. If the minister has
spent any time during the Anti-Poverty Week, as some of us in this Legislat=
ive
Assembly have done — taking the rough route at the invitation of the =
anti-poverty
organizations here — you know that there are some very unsafe places
where people are forced to sleep at night and under very unsafe conditions.
We’re talking about the back alleys, we’re talking about the
riverbanks, and we’re talking about the clay cliffs. So is this the desired outcome of t=
he law,
essentially, to punish the homeless or to say, “There is no place for
you. We’re just going to push you so you can’t be seen, so
we’re not offended?” Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: There’s nothing safe about the
riverbank. There is nothing safe about the clay cliffs. There’s nothi=
ng
safe about the camping situation at the main administration building —
drugs, alcohol, fights, assaults and other forms of violence, used needles =
littering
the campground and the playground area, lack of proper sanitation, the
showering in the children’s playground, vandalism — there’=
;s
nothing safe about that. Therein lies why we’re here today. Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; The minister ci=
tes that
it’s the same citation he used last week, and I say to him again, as I
said earlier this afternoon, why not use the provisions of the Criminal =
Code,
if you think there are criminal actions occurring? Why not use the Public Health and Safety Act if you
think that that is applicable? Why is it necessary to go to this extreme?=
span> One of the provisions in this regul=
ation is
section 4(2)(b), where it talks about “erect, use, occupy or maintain=
any
structure in or on any government facility”. I mentioned earlier that
there is another piece of case law that I thought was kind of interesting. =
This
is in City of These Falun Gong practitioners had =
erected
this structure on the sidewalk as a political display near the Chinese cons=
ulate.
In this case, it was a city law that provided in section 71 that “A
person must not build, construct, place, maintain, occupy, or cause to be
built, constructed …” — and I see language similar here
— “… placed, maintained or occupied in any street, any
structure, object, substance or thing which is an obstruction to the free u=
se
of such street, or which may encroach thereon …” or lay or
construct or reconstruct any sidewalk on any street without first obtaining=
the
written permission — which we don’t even have. I’ll come =
back
to the written permission portion here. The group, the Falun Dafa, appealed=
and the
Court of Appeal struck down that section of the law as unconstitutional. The
Court of Appeal found that section 71 of the law infringed the Falun Gong
practitioners’ right to freedom of expression because: a) the section
created an absolute prohibition on the structures; and b) no bylaw or policy
existed to grant exceptions for a political structure. As the draft regulations define
“facility” as the buildings and areas “ordinarily used in
connection with”, including paths and sidewalks, I’m wondering =
if
the minister could explain to us if he had instructed drafters to look at t=
his
case law. The second part of that: Is he confident the minister’s pos=
ition
will suffice, given the precedent that has been set in Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: As clearly laid out in the regulati=
on,
this provision respects the Charter and ensures that we consider sev=
eral
factors when deciding whether to deal with a particular situation. As I have
already mentioned, we have to take into account people’s rights under=
the
Charter. We have to consider These provisions do not require any=
action.
They allow for action only if we determine that there is a risk to public
safety and to our institutions. This amendment and regulations are designed=
to
ensure thoughtful review of the factors on a case-by-case basis before we a=
ct.
These measures provide us with the tools to act if action and only if actio=
n is
required. Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; That is another=
large
leap of faith that Yukoners are being to asked to take here, that assuming
— and perhaps the minister opposite is that Solomon-like minister who
will be able to make those wise decisions, but it is off the cuff, I would
suggest, without any sort of clarification as to how he is going to make th=
ose
decisions. But let’s go back a bit, befo=
re we
get into section 5 that he was just referencing there. The minister respons=
ible
for Highways and Public Works has the responsibility, as he has said, for t=
his
regulation flowing from the amended act. So my question is this: How will t=
he
act amendments and then the regulation that the government is planning to r=
ound
through be enforced? I mean, I really don’t envy the public servants =
who
will be tasked with telling folks — the homeless, peaceful protesters=
, et
cetera — to move along. So I’m asking how will it be
enforced, and secondly, what are the projected costs associated with
enforcement of these regulations? Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: I said this earlier. We’re in=
the
preliminary stages. The operational policies are being drafted and we are
working on the implementation component of this regulation. When it comes to
costs, if there is a set of regulations, and the public knows that the righ=
t to
peaceful protest is there, they will have no issue with that. But when it t=
urns
into some things like those we discussed earlier, we’ll have to look =
at
it on a case-by-case basis. Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; Again, without =
any
clarification of how he’s going — what determinative tests he w=
ill
use to make those assessments — we’re putting an awful lot of f=
aith
in this minister and future ministers without having anything back in retur=
n in
terms of a quid pro quo, here. The minister spoke of limits on the exercise=
of
freedom. He said that no one has more rights than others to use property.
I’m wondering — and I’ll try to come at this another way
— how he squares this with the Charter
of Rights and Freedoms. The Canadian Civil Liberties Association says t=
hat,
in order to survive constitutional scrutiny, laws must, at minimum, make
reasonable and clear exceptions for the exercise of expression and peaceful
assembly. I question whether the amendment and draft regulations meet the
constitutional test. Is the requirement for minister’s permission con=
tained
in the draft regulation enough to satisfy sections 1 and 7 of the Charter? Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: As clearly laid out in the regulati=
on,
this provision respects the Charter=
and
ensures that we consider several factors when deciding whether to deal with
this particular situation. As I’ve already mentioned, we have to take
into account people’s rights under the Charter. We have to consider Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; Section 3, loit=
ering or
nuisance, says “No person shall loiter or commit any nuisance in or on
any government facility”. This is the classic power to move folks alo=
ng.
Other jurisdictions are complaint-driven. This seems to be a pretty blunt
instrument. How does this treat youth? How will it treat youth who are loun=
ging
around in the sun? How about youth in communities where there is nothing to=
do?
My question for the minister is whether there is a question as to the
constitutionality of loitering laws. Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: Like I alluded to earlier, it’=
;s at
the discretion of the minister. To serve someone will be at the discretion =
of
the minister. It won’t be the staff who works in here, telling people=
to
“Beep, beep, beep, off the property, off the property.” It̵=
7;s
at the discretion of the minister. When it comes to the minister, like it d=
id
last year when we had a health and safety issue, as a government we discuss=
ed
this and we looked at best practices on what to do. I might add, we put a l=
ot
of thought into it, taking into consideration everyone. Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; I seek clarific=
ation
from the minister. The sectio=
n just
says, “No person shall loiter.” Is the minister going to be goi=
ng
around to every government facility determining who is loitering and who is=
not
loitering? What is he talking about here, really? Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: This is considered the best legal a=
dvice
available to us with thorough review of all available case law. Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; So I take that =
as a
non-answer to my question. Basically, the question is about the
constitutionality of loitering laws, and he tells me that he is going to be=
the
one who determines who is loitering or committing any nuisance on any publi=
c or
government facilities. It seems to me that he is going to have a thousand e=
yes.
That is what he just told me, that he is the one who is going to be doing i=
t.
Why would we be going backwards in terms of using a blunt instrument in say=
ing
that, when really you are looking for the exception rather than assuming th=
at
people who are hanging about or out wandering, relaxing on or near a govern=
ment
facility are loitering? Is that the message that we want to be giving to our
young people? Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: This would be for rare cases, very =
rare
cases, if there was an extreme problem. Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; If it is a rare=
case,
then why do we use the blunt instrument in saying, “No person shall
loiter”? Why? Why not just say — why have it there are all? Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: A variety of legislation across I trust my staff. That’s why
we’re here today to talk about this and this is the reason that we ha=
ve
this. Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; It’s unfo=
rtunate
to have to remind the minister that we’re talking about ministerial
responsibility and ministerial accountability for any piece of legislation =
or
regulations thereof that he brings into this Legislative Assembly. It has
nothing, nothing to do with the confidence, the skill and the professionali=
sm
of public servants. That is taken as a given. It has never been under quest=
ion
by the Official Opposition. The minister needs to understand that he alone =
is
responsible and accountable for everything done in his department. There is no question at all ever ab=
out the
professionalism of public servants. Let us be very clear about that. ItR=
17;s
inappropriate for the minister to be making those kinds of remarks. =
I’d like to turn to section 4=
, if I
may. Section 4 speaks to the fact that no one, except under the authority of
the minister, may — and I’ll speak to 4(1)(b) — enter a
government facility into which the public is not permitted entry. Can the
minister explain what the implications of this are? Does this mean that
Yukoners can expect less access to government facilities? Could the ministe=
r explain
(4)(1)(b)? Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: It has to do with barging into publ=
ic
spaces — breaking and entering at night. It has nothing to do with
regular day-to-day use of government facilities. Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; Okay. Then, in =
that
case, would the minister opposite explain why he wouldn’t use the
appropriate criminal enactments to deal with those kinds of things? If some=
body
is committing a criminal act, you use the Criminal Code. You don’t use his authority, =
really.
While he is thinking about that, perhaps he could also give consideration t=
o section
4(1)(c) which states that, “No person shall, except under the authori=
ty
of the Minister place or post anything, any material or any object
…” Again, the question I have is, what are the implications in
this, for example, during elections, on citizens placing signs advocating f=
or
something? For example, we have seen a number of campaigns in this territor=
y,
in this municipality, in Whitehorse in particular, where there are issues t=
hat
come up and we see sandwich board signs go up — pro this, anti that, =
or
whatever. What are the implications with respect to that restriction on
citizens’ freedom of expression with section 4(1)(c)? Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: We are talking about extreme cases.=
These
provisions do not require an action; they allow for action only if we deter=
mine
that there is a risk to public safety and to our institutions. Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; Section 4(2) sa=
ys that,
“No person shall, except as permitted under subsection (3) —
without minister’s permission, they cannot occupy or reside in a camp=
in
or on any government facility. So my question is looking to get clarificati=
on
about this — except with the minister’s permission, subject to
conditions or limitations. What conditions are we talking about here? Is it=
the
length of stay? Is there a requirement for some form of liability insurance=
? We
have seen this as the federal government has privatized its interest in fed=
eral
buildings across the country. Whereas you would have simple public displays,
now people are required to have significant liability insurance before they=
can
even gather on the foreground of the You know, I raise this for the mini=
ster
opposite because Canadian Civil Liberties Association has raised the issue =
that
unreasonable conditions, like insurance requirements, do infringe on democr=
atic
rights. I am really asking the minister if he could explain to us what those
conditions or limitations are going to be in order to get the minister̵=
7;s
permission. For example, I don’t know, XYZ organization comes and says
they would like to hold a demonstration. What will be the limitations that =
the
minister will give immediately upon having passed or rammed through this le=
gislation
and these regulations? Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: Like I alluded to earlier, although
it’s in its preliminary stage, operational policies are being drafted=
and
we are working on the implementation component of this regulation.=
p>
Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; Then we’r=
e being
asked again to take a pig in a poke and believe that he’s going to co=
me
forward with something in the future. Why are we ramming these regulations
forward if we have not thought through the implications and cannot answer t=
hese
simple questions? People need to know. This is anothe=
r reason
why this should be going out to public consultation, so that they can get t=
he
full context from all Yukoners and not simply say, “Trust us. We̵=
7;re
going to think about it in the future.” No. If you’re going to =
do
it and it’s going to have an impact and restrict the rights and freed=
oms
of Yukoners now, then it’s better to have the regulations ready now.<=
/span> I’d like to move on to 5(2). =
This
section really has a lot of power. I mean, if we look at this, we’re
basically again expanding the basis of faith and hope and trust in some
minister — not necessarily simply this one, but future ministers as w=
ell.
It’s a lot of power for a minister to possess. Section 5(2) says, “In determ=
ining
whether notice under subsection (1) will be given to a person in respect of=
the
person’s practice or activity at a government facility, the Minister =
is
to take into consideration …” The first one is the Charter of Rights and Freedoms. We=
ll, I
would hope that the minister would take the Charter
into account. He had better; it’s the law of the land. It’s=
a
given. Why would — anyways, it’s there. So, the Charter of Rights and Freedoms, we=
’re
assuming, and because it is the law of the land that he would be doing that
— but 5(2)(b) says, “ Could the minister expand on his th=
oughts
on our experience of diverse forms of peaceful expression? What exactly does
that mean in the minister opposite’s mind? Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: Road rallies, snowmobile races, nig=
httime
vigils. Thank you, Madam Chair. Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; I can certainly
understand the last one. Nighttime vigils are a traditional, respectful use=
of
peaceful demonstration. Road rallies — I’m not quite so sure how
you get possibly those on the limited space of public lands adjacent to the
Yukon administration building, but maybe he knows something I don’t k=
now of
what’s being planned for this poor city. This brings me to section 5(2)(c)(i=
i),
because that speaks to the ability of other persons to use the government
facility or any nearby facility for its intended use. So I guess, speaking =
to
that, it would useful to have the minister explain to this Legislative Asse=
mbly
what the intended use is of the Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: Of course. This isn’t about
peaceful assembly — the right to protest under the Charter of Righ=
ts.
This requires the minister to consider a number of relevant factors in
determining whether a notice should be given under the subsection. We’=
;ve
talked about the Charter of Rights. We’ve talked about the rig=
ht
to freedom of speech and freedom to protest. That’s not what it’=
;s
about. Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; That’s a =
rather
perplexing answer. I was asking if there are any places where the intended =
use
— any places, when I’m looking at section 5(2)(c)(ii), speaks to
the ability of other persons to use the government facility or any nearby
facility for its intended purpose. My question was simply this: Are there a=
ny
places — in the context of how it is being used in this subsection
— where the intended use is for protest or peaceful assembly?<=
/p>
Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: We don’t place limits on peop=
le’s
rights to peacefully assemble on public property. Thank you. Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; I would argue &=
#8212;
and I don’t think it’s much of an argument, it’s actually=
a
statement of fact that every aspect of this regulation is intended to place
limits on peaceful use and assembly. That’s what the whole issue is a=
bout
— the minister’s discretion to determine how much of a limitati=
on
can be placed on these Charter =
rights
and freedoms that we treasure so much in this country. He’s incorrect=
, I
would suggest, to be saying that this is not about that. It is, in fact, all
about that. That’s the basis of these regulations. Section 5(2)(c)(iv)
speaks about the dignity of any court or other public institution — so
he’s to take into consideration the dignity of any court or other pub=
lic
institution that is located at or near the government facility. My question=
to
the minister is how “dignity”, in this context, is defined? Is =
the
dignity of the Legislative Assembly, for example, diminished by tent city or
the Occupy Whitehorse camper van? Was it diminished last year by the peacef=
ul
use of those facilities by those people? So I’m asking for the minist=
er
to define, in this context, “dignity”. Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: There was nothing safe about the ca=
mping
situation at the administration building last year. I alluded to the drugs,=
the
alcohol, the fights, the assaults and other forms of violence. This is what
these regulations and this amendment is about. Day-to-day operations of the=
Legislature
are day-to-day operations. Thank you. Ms.
Moorcroft: I would just li=
ke to
follow up with the minister on this particular amendment that refers to the=
dignify
of the court or other public institutions located at or near the government
facility. In the line of questions being pursued by my colleague, the Leade=
r of
the Official Opposition, with the minister, the minister has made the asser=
tion
that this proposed amendment to the Financial Administration Act and=
the
regulations of government facilities will not place limits on peaceful use =
and
assembly on public property. At the section 4 of the government
facilities use regulation about unauthorized activity, it says that “=
No
person shall, except under the authority of the Minister … enter any
government facility into which the public is not permitted entry” =
212;
that is item (b) — and item (c) is: “place or post any thing, a=
ny
material or any object in or on any government facility other than in a
location that is specifically designated for that purpose”. Now,
I’m really interested in knowing what this government’s
interpretation of legitimate, peaceful use and assembly is. There have been
many rallies held over the years in this building and in other But I’m concerned about the a=
bility
of this minister to then say, “I will not grant permission for people=
to
rally and speak out in protest. I will not allow people to have billboards =
and
signs that address the matter of public comment,” whether it’s
something like the rally I just referred to, or whether it’s a peacef=
ul
vigil being held, for example, on the International Day for the Elimination=
of
Racial Discrimination. I would like to know whether the mi=
nister
would define the “dignity of the court” and whether, in his
assessment, it would violate the dignity of the court for events such as a
pots-and-pans rally that was held by people to argue that certain actions w=
ere
not appropriate and to bring forward their peaceful expression of protest.<=
/span> Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: I thank the member opposite for all=
uding
to some great examples of peaceful protest in the Assembly or at government
facilities. This regulation respects the Charter and ensures that we
allow for this. This is not what it’s about. It’s about safety =
to
our institutions, and I alluded to it, and I can go through it many times
— knife fights, drugs, alcohol, feces — that is what it’s
about. The right to protest, peaceful protest. Ms.
Moorcroft: The minister is=
saying
that this will not diminish the public’s right to engage in activities
that are permitted by the Charter of Rights and Freedoms. However, t=
he
regulation allows the minister to give permission, through the use of his
authority, to enter government facilities and to post materials. And if they
don’t have permission, the regulations also provide for offences and
penalties. I would like the minister to stand and give this Assembly today =
his
absolute assurance that peaceful expressions of protest will be allowed wit=
hout
the minister giving his permission in advance. I’ll pause while the Governme=
nt House
Leader tells him how he should answer that question. Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: I was listening. Like I alluded to,
absolutely — to the member opposite — only, only, only if there=
is
a risk to public safety and to our institutions. I’ve said it on nume=
rous
occasions in this House: the regulation respects the Charter and ensures that we consider several factors when decid=
ing
whether to deal with a particular situation. They allow for actions only if=
we
determine that there is a risk to public safety and to our institutions. =
span> Ms.
Moorcroft: That’s ve=
ry
broad. How will the minister determine whether there is a risk to public sa=
fety
in the actions of citizens of the Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: No, Madam Chair. That’s the r=
ight
to peaceful protest. Ms.
Moorcroft: I thank the min=
ister
for his response. Could he now also reply as to how he would assess whether
there is a risk to public safety? Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: As I alluded to earlier, it will be=
case
by case. It’s about public safety and safety of our facilities. Ms.
Moorcroft: Could the minis=
ter
provide one or two examples of the kind of criteria that the minister or the
minister’s office would use in determining on a case-by-case basis?=
span> Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: Public and underaged drinking, need=
le and
drug use, lack of proper sanitation, public nudity, theft, violence, fighti=
ng,
vandalism, risk of injury, fire due to unsafe heating methods and unsafe
conditions for staff coming to work are just a few. Mr.
Barr:=
195; I do have a cou=
ple of
questions for the minister opposite. I guess it just goes along with what
we’ve been talking about and getting some clarification as to
what’s allowed and what’s not allowed. I was in the coffee shop=
just
last week and I was speaking with another fellow there who was just concern=
ed
about his rent increase. It was up 22.5 percent in his building. As we were
having a short conversation about that, there was another young fellow R=
12;
he was about 27 or 28 — overhearing the conversation. The rent-increa=
se
guy took my card and the other young lad started speaking to me and said,
“Well, I’m going to be setting up with this year’s tent
city.” I said, “Oh, well, there are just some things going on in
the House and maybe you won’t be able to do that, actually.” He
said, “Well, I was there right at the beginning of the tent city.R=
21;
He was one of the first folks. He mentioned the name of the first woman who
actually set up there for reasons of safety and so on and so forth. Now this
young guy — he’s a young dad — he has no family here, he =
went
on to explain. He had a job. He also had a young son who is living here. He=
is
not together with his common-law wife any more and wanted to remain here to=
be
able to visit with his son. He couldn’t find any place to live, so he
moved in on the lawn. He said, “There was a bunch of us kind of in the
same situation. We didn’t have a place to go to. We couldn’t af=
ford
camping space.” He said for the first while there it was great. I
can’t exactly say how long. He said probably the first month and half=
. He
said, “There was a bunch of us there. We were having communal corn
roasts. We were helping each other out.” He said it was like a little
community. He said, “Things were very nice there for that amount of t=
ime.
Then there were a few occasions when some other folks moved in there.”
And he talked about drugs, and he talked about drinking, and he talked about
some fights and things. He said he wished that wouldn’t have happened=
. He
said he didn’t know why that was going on there. He said it ruined a =
good
thing for the people who had no place to go. They were there because they h=
ad
no place to go. Then he said, “The snow is almost gone. I’m goi=
ng
to be setting up my tent there. I’ve already figured it out.”
He’s living in his car, by the way. He said, “If it weren’t=
for the
young couple who actually took me in over the winter for a nominal rent, I
don’t know what I would have done, because there is just no place for
me.” He then went on to say they are selling their house, otherwise he
would stay there.” He said, “With the market prices the way they
are, they are going to sell their house and cash in. So now I have no place,
but that is my plan. I actually developed this nice shelter that I am going=
to
pitch outside the doors out here. I made some stakes, and I am going to be =
able
to do this for under $20 or $25. I am going down to the local store, and I =
have
a plan of how I am going to set up accommodation there.” I said, “I cannot give you pe=
rmission
and you might want to look into this further” — because of what=
we
are discussing here today. And he certainly did not want to be breaking any
law, and he certainly was not talking about knife fights of his own. He was=
not
talking about anything, other than he has no other place to go. So further =
on
in the conversation: If they cannot be there then, where can they go —
the people who don’t have housing? We’re not talking about the p=
eople
who ruin it for others. Those are always there in society. Is the minister
hearing what I’m saying as to this person’s plight — as to
what we’re talking about here today — and not the dangerous
situations where there are criminal laws in effect, where people can address
these situations — to have a place where somebody can live? And there=
are
people waiting. There have been other conversations since then, I’ve
heard. So will the minister respond to this story? Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: Like I alluded to earlier, and the =
member
opposite alluded to the knife fight, this is a property management issue, a=
nd
it’s about providing the Yukon government — our government R=
12;
with the tools to manage, maintain, protect and ensure proper access to
government facilities. That’s what this is about. Mr.
Barr:=
195; Will the minist=
er then
protect the people who are there peacefully, who choose to set up a living
space? Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: I’m not sure what question the
member is getting at, but this amendment is to provide us tools to protect
health and safety around our government buildings. Mr.
Barr:=
195; Where I am goin=
g is, as
I said, as things went on in the summer, yes, there were situations when ev=
en
the people who were there peacefully were concerned. As the peaceful folks =
set
up a home for themselves, will the minister commit to them being there and
protect those who are peacefully living there who have no other place to be=
? Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: The Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; So, basically w=
e are
down to — clearly the intention is as section 6 of this act —
because that is the real intention — which is the removal of persons =
and
removal of property. The process as outlined in the regulations is pretty
simple because the minister has made it really clear that he has no intenti=
on
of protecting the rights of people to simple accommodation or abode safety
— a safe place to be. If you will recall, as I said last Thursday, the
reason why people chose to put themselves on the legislative lawn was becau=
se
it was in the public view. It was safe; it was not on the riverbank; it was=
not
on the islands; it was not in the trees along the clay cliffs. The minister=
has
made it clear that this government has no intention, it has no mandate and =
no
policy to deal with homelessness and it will simply evict anybody who is fo=
und
anywhere near these premises. The process, it sounds to me, is simple: Noti=
ce
is given and then a person or property is removed by a peace officer. I will
just point out to the minister opposite that the Canadian Civil Liberties
Association wrote to mayors, and we spoke last week about the Occupy moveme=
nt,
around the evictions of people who were involved in some of those Occupy ca=
mps.
As was borne out — during the course of the next few months — b=
ut
at that time the Canadian Civil Liberties Association said, “Unilater=
al
enforcement action by police is unacceptable and dangerous. Where there are
specific concerns, good faith negotiations should take place and accommodat=
ions
found.” My question for the minister is =
212; and
it’s a two-part question, so he may want to pay attention to that =
212;
Section 6 doesn’t seem to reflect the kind of approach that those who=
work
on the frontlines utilize to diffuse situations. My question is why not? It
seems rather draconian. The second part of the question is this: How will t=
he
removal of people be conducted? Whose job is it? Again, what are the budget=
ary
implications associated with implementing this legislation? Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: I don’t agree with the member
opposite in her first question. But her second question — although
they’re in the preliminary stages, the operational policies are being
drafted, and we’re working on implementation components on this regul=
ation.
Last week, I alluded to the cost to the taxpayer for last year — $75,=
000.
That doesn’t take into consideration the many, many members of differ=
ent
government departments who were there, talking, trying to help. Everything
comes with a cost, Madam Chair. Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; There are a num=
ber of
costs — Chair: Ms. Hanson. Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; Thank you, Mada=
m Chair.
I apologize for speaking before you acknowledged me. There are costs associated and that=
’s
another issue that was raised by the Canadian Civil Liberties Association,
again, in numerous exchanges of correspondence with municipalities and other
levels of government across the country as the Occupy movement was taking
place. As I said earlier, they commented that unilateral enforcement action
through the police is unacceptable. They also suggested that any process ai=
med
at resolving what could be valid concerns from a level of government must be
conducted with sufficient transparency, participation and impartiality, tha=
t it
can be seen to be a legitimate process by all those involved, not waiting, =
as
we’ve heard today, for some as yet undefined process to fold out. In =
the
event that reasonable and pressing concerns truly cannot be addressed throu=
gh
dialogue and an injunction — in this case, this is where the referenc=
e is
because we don’t see provisions for injunctions here. Maybe they are =
and
we just haven’t heard about them yet. A legitimate legal process would re=
quire
that protesters — or people who are occupying the space — be gi=
ven
sufficient notice that they can retain and instruct counsel. If those indiv=
iduals
cannot afford to pay legal counsel, this cost should be borne by the govern=
ment
since this is the party seeking clarification and direction from the court.=
My question for the minister is =
212; as
he’s assessing the future costs of implementing this amendment to the=
Financial
Administration Act and as he’s assessing the cost of implementing
these as yet not completely fleshed-out regulations — is he anticipat=
ing
the costs of legal counsel for those who he will be forcing into the courts=
? Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: I might add to the member opposite:
that’s why we have the legal aid system. Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; I hope that peo=
ple can
take some comfort from the minister’s comment there. Section 10 speak=
s to
the offence — this is all offensive, but — it says the person is
guilty of an offence if he contravenes section 4, and then it goes on to
elaborate a bunch of other things you can do to be offensive under this
regulation. The bottom line is that the government is now finding new ways =
to
fill up the jail. Persons who are guilty of an offence under subsection (1)=
are
liable on summary conviction to a fine of not more than $1,000 or imprisonm=
ent
for not more than six months, or to both fine and imprisonment. So my quest=
ion
for the minister, or perhaps the government as a whole: How does this
government expect the victims of the housing crisis — I mean, we̵=
7;re
not making this up in terms of a housing crisis. Every one of those members=
opposite
have accepted the fact and stated publicly that they now acknowledge that t=
hey
created a housing crisis in this territory, and now we’re saying that
those people who are forced to camp will be forced — camping as their
only source of accommodation; the only place they can find — they cou=
ld
be forced to fork out $1,000? They are not going to be able to do=
that,
so they will be imprisoned for six months for camping on the grounds of the
Legislative Assembly. Can the minister explain how this is fair to Yukoners and how that fits with =
the Charter
of Rights and Freedoms? Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: Like I alluded to earlier, this is =
a property
management issue. It is about government having the ability to deal with
extreme issues on a case-by-case basis. The maximum penalty gives courts
flexibility. The maximum is for the worst possible offence. You read under =
the
act that a person “… is liable on summary conviction to a fine =
of
not more than $1,000 or imprisonment for not more than six months, or to bo=
th
fine and imprisonment.” The member opposite alluded to challenges to =
some
of the things that happened across the country. This is — all legislation =
212; you
have to have something in there. We’ve piggybacked on our federal
counterparts on this. Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; As I said last =
week,
it’s clear there are many, many unanswered questions and it’s
unfortunate that the government is choosing to ram this legislation and the
regulations forward. They’re clearly — based on the responses or
non-responses to the considered questions that we’ve placed here today
and last week — this has not been thought out thoroughly. There are
implications that need to be considered. There is a need for public
consultation. As I said earlier, the Official Opp=
osition
finds the proposed regulations and the amendment to the Financial Admini=
stration
Act wanting in terms of any responsible test of meeting what is good po=
licy
or good law. I’m not going to go on any longer. It’s clear that
there is an intention to ram this through. We will peacefully protest that, bu=
t I want
to leave with a last comment from general counsel for the Canadian Civil Li=
berties
Association who, in commenting on similar matters, last November, just a few
short months ago, said, “Although the right to peaceful assembly is n=
ot
absolute, it must be protected and can only be limited by measures specific=
ally
tailored to meet serious and urgent objectives” — serious and
urgent objectives. “Law
enforcement and government officials have a duty to facilitate peaceful pro=
test
and assembly and to protect those participating in such activities. Health =
and
safety concerns should be addressed, as well as the need to ensure that the
broader public can reasonably access public spaces”. But concerns =
212;
and this, Madam Chair, is the key part here: “Concerns about aestheti=
cs
or simple assertions that individuals have been exercising their
constitutionally protected democratic rights for ‘long enough’ =
are
insufficient reasons to ‘evict’ protestors from public
spaces.” With that, I will end my questions =
for the
minister. Mr.
Elias:=
8195; I have been listening to the tantalizing debate over the last
couple of hours and it seems like we are all very well versed in constituti=
onal
law. Basically, this is fairly clear to me. Over the last couple of hours, I ha=
ve
listened to the minister responsible provide explanations to the multitude =
of
questions that have been put on the floor of the House. In this instance, in
this instance, in this instance — I said it three times for Hansar=
d —
I accept the minister’s justification of this legislation on the floo=
r of
the House today. In saying that, the Yukon Party, in the past, has brought
forward pieces of legislation that were questionable, and we did challenge =
them
on it — the civil forfeiture law comes to mind, Madam Chair. <=
/p>
With regard to the housing issue, t=
he Yukon
Party should get to work and deal with the hard-to-house, the homeless and
people with special needs. That’s obviously a need in this territory =
that
perpetuated some of the problems that we dealt with last summer, that were
dealt with at great length here, but it is clear to me that this amendment
specifically empowers government to manage all public properties for the
overall benefit of all citizens of our territory. I will make a couple of points with=
regard
to public consultation. I’ll go to what I understand and what I know.
Under 16.4.2 of the Vuntut Gwitchin First Nation Final Agreement, it
says that the Vuntut Gwitchin citizens can harvest wildlife in any number, =
and
any sex, at any time of the year and can only be limited by a couple of thi=
ngs
— public safety, public health and conservation. That document is protected by the h=
ighest
law in this country. So, case law is already there. When I hear the minister
say that he has looked at case law, it’s compliant with the Charter of Rights and Freedoms, he=
has
looked at other jurisdictions that already have this law — and if mem=
ory
serves me correctly, we already have laws in this territory that deal with =
making
empowering regulations and proposing amendments that make contravention an
offence and empower seizures. I believe it’s under the Fisheries Act. It’s under th=
e Parks Act. It’s under the Wildlife Act. It’s under the=
Environment Act and regulations of
protected areas. You’re allowed to remove someone from a protected ar=
ea
when they’re in contravention of that act. That case law is already
there. That’s not my constitutional law background coming through,
because I don’t have one. Anyway, I’m just speaking of what I k=
now.
So, I think that this law is in compliance. But I do have a question that is im=
portant
to me. In developing this law, before it came to the floor of this House
— can the minister reiterate that there has been a forensic-like exam=
ination
of case law throughout our country and that it has gone through the test of
being compliant with the Charter of Rights and Freedoms and that they
looked at other jurisdictions who have this law that have not been challeng=
ed
in court as of yet in our country. Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: There are no absolute guarantees wi=
th
case law, but we did our due diligence and the questions the member opposite
asked — our great staff worked hard on this. Yes, we looked into
everything, thoroughly, so I thank the member opposite for his comments. Mr.
Elias:=
8195; Just with the indulgence of the House, I believe it was the p=
resent
Minister of Community Services and I who got into a debate about the lands =
and
their usefulness. I think it was maybe four years ago. The society that exi=
sts
under the clay cliffs north of here — they have raised beds and they =
grow
food and so I did some research. I talked with several Yukoners who thought
about what the land south of the Legislative Assembly near Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; I just wanted to
clarify a comment that the MLA for Vuntut Gwitchin made that yes, in fact,
there was significant debate in this Legislative Assembly on the proposed Y=
ukon
Party civil forfeiture legislation. If he’ll recall, it was —
statements made by the members of the Yukon Party — “look, civil
forfeiture legislation exists everywhere else in Chair: Is there any further debate? Would the members like a recess? All
Hon. Members: Agreed. Chair: Committee of the Whole will recess for 15 minutes. Recess Chair:
Committee=
of the
Whole will now come to order. We begin clause-by-clause debate on Bill No. =
40, Act
to Amend the Financial Administration Act. On
Clause 1 Clause
1 agreed to On
Clause 2 Clause
2 agreed to On
Clause 3 Clause
3 agreed to On
Title Title
agreed to Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: I move that Bill No. 40, entitled <=
i>Act
to Amend the Financial Administration Act, be reported without amendmen=
t. Chair: Before we get to Mr. Istchenko’s request, I would like =
it
noted that all clauses have carried. It has been moved by Mr. Istchenko =
that
Bill No. 40, entitled Act to Amend the Financial Administration Act,=
be
reported without amendment. Motion agreed to Hon.
Mr. Cathers: I move that the Speaker do now resu=
me the
Chair. Chair: It has been moved by Mr. Cathers that the Speaker do now resu=
me the
Chair. Motion
agreed to Speaker
resumes the Chair Speaker: I will now call the House to order. INTRODUCTION OF VISITO=
RS Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; I would like to=
ask the
House to join me in welcoming Mary Amerongen to the Legislative Assembly to=
day.
Mary is a long-time social activist working with poor people and others
throughout the territory. But she’s also a unique citizen in the sense
that her commitment to the social justice issues extended to gifting each o=
ne
of us as members of this Legislative Assembly a book called Eaarth by
Bill McKibben, which talks about the serious challenges of climate change. I
both thank Mary and welcome her to this Legislative Assembly. Applause Speaker: May the House have a report from the Chair of Committee of the
Whole? Chair’s report Ms.
McLeod: Mr. Speaker, Committee of the Whole=
has
considered Bill No. 40, entitled Act to Amend the Financial Administrati=
on
Act, and directed me to report the bill without amendment. Speaker: You have heard the report from the Chair of Committee of the =
Whole?
Are you agreed? Some
Hon. Members: Agreed. Speaker: I declare the report carried. GOVERNMENT BILLS Bill No. 40: Act to Amend the Financial
Administration Act — Third Clerk:
Third rea=
ding,
Bill No. 40, standing in the name of the Hon. Mr. Istchenko. Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: I move that Bill No. 40, entitled <=
i>Act
to Amend the Financial Administration Act, be now read a third time and=
do
pass. Speaker: It has been moved by the Minister of Highways and Public Work=
s that
Bill No. 40, entitled Act to Amend the Financial Administration Act, be
now read a third time and do pass. Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: Yukoners expect the government to
maintain the integrity of our public institutions, to ensure our government
facilities are well-managed and accessible to everyone, and to take our
responsibilities for the safety and security of our citizens very seriously.
These minor amendments allow us to manage what happens at our public facili=
ties
and to ensure the health and safety of everyone at these facilities. Yukone=
rs
gave us a very clear mandate just a few months ago. We take these responsib=
ilities
very seriously, and for that I thank the House. Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; I won’t r=
epeat
the comments made during the course of the discussion and the debate on the
amendments to the Financial Administration Act and of more importanc=
e,
in terms of consequences for Mr.
Elias:=
8195; With regard to Bill No. 40, the Act to Amend the Financial
Administration Act, the amendment explicitly empowers regulations for t=
he
management, maintenance, proper use and protection of public property. The =
intention
of this piece of legislation seems fairly clear to me. We will be supportin=
g it
today. Basically, that’s all I have to say. Speaker: Are you prepared for the question? Some
Hon. Members: Division. =
Division Speaker: Division has been called. Bells Speaker: Mr. Clerk, please poll the House. Hon.
Mr. Pasloski: Agree. Hon.
Mr. Cathers: Agree. Hon.
Ms. Taylor: Agree. Hon.
Mr. Hon.
Mr. Nixon: Agree. Ms.
McLeod: Agree. Hon.
Mr. Istchenko: Agree. Hon.
Mr. Dixon: Agree. Mr.
Hassard: Agree. Ms.
Hanson:&=
#8195; Disagree. Mr.
Tredger:=
Disagree. Ms.
Moorcroft: Disagree. Ms.
White:=
8195; Disagree. Mr.
Barr:=
195; Disagree. Mr.
Elias:=
8195; Agree. Mr.
Silver:&=
#8195; Agree. Clerk: Mr. Speaker, the results are 11 yea, five nay. Speaker: The yeas have it. I declare the motion carried. Motion for third reading of Bill=
No. 40
agreed to Speaker: I declare that Bill No. 40 has passed this House. Bill No. 36: Act to Amend the=
Liquor
Act — Third Reading Clerk: Third reading, Bill No. 36, standing in the name of the Hon. =
Mr. Hon.
Mr. Speaker: It has been moved by the minister responsible for the Yukon L=
iquor
Corporation that Bill No. 36, entitled Act to Amend the Liquor Act, =
be
now read a third time and do pass. Hon.
Mr. The second part deals with personal
importation limits. As we rapidly approach summer and Yukoners begin their
travels to southern jurisdictions, of course, enjoying the annual wine tour
that is organized by Air North, Yukon’s airline, I’m hopeful th=
at
these increases will help them to be in compliance and be able to bring bac=
k an
amount of liquor that is more in line with what we see as a national amount=
. Again, I thank the members opposite=
for the
debate on these particular amendments last week. As we near the end of today
and approach the last 15 days of debate, of course, four of those days are
allotted to private members’ business. I note that we have only really cle=
ared
approximately $40 million of our $1.156-billion budget. I am hopeful that we
can continue the good work on behalf of Yukoners and continue in that debat=
e so
that at the end of this current sitting we are able to give full and fair
consideration to all departments, including the number of bills that are st=
ill
before this House. Mr.
Barr:=
195; We did have muc=
h debate
last week in the House regarding these amendments. Just to reiterate, we
didn’t really have a problem with what the amendments are, but what w=
as
not in the amendments. We duly note that, in regard to the language, we look
forward to seeing those changes made in the various acts around language na=
mes
such as “band” and those kinds of things to reflect the current
times. Otherwise, we will be moving forward to accept the amendments as
written. Motion for third reading of Bill=
No. 36
agreed to Speaker: I declare that Bill No. 36 has passed this House. Bill No. 37: Act to Amend the=
Clerk: Second reading, Bill No. 37, standing in the name of the Hon.=
Mr.
Nixon. Hon.
Mr. Nixon: I move that Bill No. 37, entitled <=
i>Act
to Amend the Territorial Court Act, be now read a second time.=
p>
Speaker: It has been moved by the Minister of Justice that Bill No. 37,
entitled Act to Amend the Territorial Court Act, be now read a second
time. Hon.
Mr. Nixon: I’m pleased to be able to spe=
ak to
this House about these short amendments to the Territorial Court Act.
Our government has a strong commitment to the objectives of practising good
government and, to that end, I’m bringing forward these amendments to=
the
Territorial Court Act that will support a shortened and simplified
process for the appointment of deputy judges of the There are three permanent judges in=
the Permanent judges are appointed from
recommendations brought forward by senior members of the Yukon Bar Association. There is a leng=
thy
process for selecting the best possible candidates to sit on our Deputy judges have the same powers =
as
permanent judges. They are called upon to sit when permanent judges are not
available due to caseload or when no permanent judge can sit due to conflic=
ts.
Because Mr. Speaker, I am confident that th=
ese
amendments that are before you will have the effect of ensuring the highest=
standards
for the administration of justice in Ms.
Moorcroft: I thank the min=
ister
for his opening comments on the Act to Amend the Territorial Court Act=
i>
which, as he indicated, are fairly straightforward amendments to reflect the
current practices for appointments of deputy judges. I do have some comments
and some questions regarding this amendment. The appointment process, as
indicated on the court website, states that not less than three and not more
than eight qualified candidates are submitted to the Minister of Justice. I
find it very interesting to note that — Some
Hon. Member: (Inaudible)=
Ms.
Moorcroft: Oh, I’ll =
wait
until the Government House Leader is finished. There is a section 4 in the amendin=
g act
that adds a provision regarding the selection of deputy judges. In section =
2 of
that amendment, it says that, if the council considers that the appointment=
of
a deputy judge is required or if the minister advises the council that a de=
puty
judge is to be appointed, the council shall submit to the minister the name=
of
at least one person who qualifies for the appointment. If I can explain why=
I
have a question regarding that new provision in the act — it goes to
whether the minister will have the ability to select a deputy judge from a =
list
of qualified candidates or if the minister has only one name, then the mini=
ster
must appoint that one deputy judge.
I note that in the websites of the =
courts
— the Territorial Court of I would also ask this: If deputy ju=
dges are
retired, is there an age limit for them? I’ll be looking to hear from=
the
minister during debate in Committee about how the choice is made for which
deputy judge is called. We have at present one woman on the bench in the =
span> Some
Hon. Member: (Inaudible) INTRODUCTION OF VISITO=
RS Hon.
Mr. Nixon: I’d like to have my
colleagues’ indulgence in introducing my wife, Danielle. Applause Speaker: Member for Copperbelt South, please continue. Ms.
Moorcroft: I would like to=
welcome
the minister’s wife to the Assembly as well. I’ll refrain from
making a comment about how welcome it is to know that there are strong wome=
n in
support of men in the Assembly. As I was saying, in looking to the
appointment process for deputy judges, I would like to be assured that the
minister — when they’re considering recommendations of the Judi=
cial
Council in making appointments of deputy judges — has the ability to
appoint qualified First Nation candidates, to appoint qualified candidates =
who
are women, so that we can, in fact, move toward a more representative bench
here in the Yukon, as elsewhere. I am also interested in the annual =
budget
of travel expenses for deputy judges. I am interested in knowing how long it
may take for the replacement of a retiring judge, or if a recruitment proce=
ss
will be started shortly, or whether the government anticipates there may be=
a
need to appoint a deputy judge for a year or longer until a recruitment pro=
cess
for a retiring judge can be completed. With that, I look forward to further
debate in Committee. Mr.
Silver:&=
#8195; Thank you. I ri=
se to
offer comments from the Liberal caucus on Bill No. 37, Act to Ame=
nd
the Territorial Court Act. This amendment acknowledges the rol=
e deputy
judges play in our territorial court system, which is that of judges, but o=
n an
impermanent basis. The existing act empowers deputy judges and includes some
provisions for the accreditation and practices. It does not, however,
explicitly delineate a process for their recruitment, qualification or appo=
intment.
The Territorial Court Act does include some provisions for permanent
judges and the proposed amendments outline a new process for deputy judges =
that
is similar to those established for permanent judges. We support published
transparent and consistent processes for appointments of deputy judges. This
encourages public confidence in our deputy judges and, through them, in the
judicial system as a whole. These amendments prove such transpa=
rencies
and promote such confidences. On an aside, public confidence also comes when
people feel that the judicial system encourages their meaningful participat=
ion.
Our circuit courts are meant to deliver judicial proceedings throughout the=
This means that defendants often ca=
nnot
make out what the lawyers are saying and this is not an adequate access to
legal counsel. We are hearing this from the citizens in Old Crow, There have been regular cancellatio=
ns of
circuit court and if justice delayed is justice denied, then this must also=
be
remedied. In conclusion, the amendments put forward today redress outstandi=
ng
issues related to the qualification and the appointment of deputy judges.
Access to these deputy judges and to all judges and legal counsel must exte=
nd
fully to all Motion for second reading of Bil=
l No. 37
agreed to Hon.
Mr. Cathers: I move that the Speaker do now leav=
e the
Chair and that the House resolve into Committee of the Whole. Speaker: It has been moved by the Government House Leader that the Spe=
aker
do now leave the Chair and that the House resolve into Committee of the Who=
le. Motion agreed to Speaker leaves the Chair<=
/i> COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE=
Chair: Committee of the Whole will now come to order. The matter before the Committee is =
general
debate on Bill No. 37, Act to Amend the Territorial Court Act. We are
going to take a 10-minute recess while the officials settle in. Recess Chair: Order. Committee of the Whole will now come to order.<=
/p>
Bill No. 37: Act to Amend the=
Chair: The matter before the Committee is general debate on Bill No.=
37, Act
to Amend the Territorial Court Act. Hon.
Mr. Nixon: I’d just like to reiterate a =
few
points here that I already made in my earlier speech, one being that our
government has a very strong commitment to the objectives of practising good
government. That’s why I’m bringing these amendments to the =
Territorial
Court Act forward. It’s also important to me as minister and to t=
he
department that we have available an excellent roster of deputy judges to c=
all
upon who can step in to hear those cases in a timely manner. To reiterate, the objective of these
amendments to the Territorial Court Act is to ensure that there are
sufficient judges sitting to meet the demands of the justice system. I̵=
7;m
confident that these amendments that are before you will have the effect of
ensuring the highest standards for the administration of justice in =
Ms.
Moorcroft: In the second r=
eading
debate on Bill No. 37, I spoke to the minister about the issue of retirement
age. I understand that one of the reasons for these amendments is that at t=
he
present time one of the sitting Hon.
Mr. Nixon: To answer the member opposite’=
;s
question, it is indeed up to the Chief Judge to make those recommendations =
and
bring deputy judges in. It is on a case-by-case basis, so if they’re
needed we bring them in. Ms.
Moorcroft: Could the minis=
ter then
provide us with some information regarding the process for the replacement =
of
the position that will become vacant following Judge Faulkner’s
retirement? Has a recruitment process been initiated? How long does he
anticipate that it will take? Hon.
Mr. Nixon: The government recently received no=
tice
by the judiciary that Judge Faulkner would be retiring effective this July,=
and
we thank the judge for his time on the bench. He made many considered rulin=
gs
while serving his fellow Yukoners as a Territorial Court Judge. The replace=
ment
of a judge is a lengthy process that can take up to a year and I am told th=
at
the judiciary will manage this by using deputy judges to fill any gaps in t=
he
capacity that there are as a result of any vacancies. Ms.
Moorcroft: Is the minister=
able to
provide any information regarding the annual budget for travel and other ex=
penses
for deputy judges? Hon.
Mr. Nixon: In fact, I do not have that informa=
tion
on me at this present time. I can look into providing that for the member
opposite. Ms.
Moorcroft: I had also spok=
en to
the minister about the retirement age for Why has the minister not considered
extending the retirement age for the Hon.
Mr. Nixon: About the age limit, for deputy jud=
ges
the age limit is 75 years old. Experience tells us that our most recent
judicial retirees have not requested an extension to the age limit; rather,
they have retired on or prior to their 65th birthday. A future government could consider =
upping
the limit, but since the two remaining judges are too young to retire at th=
is
time, this will need to be a consideration at a later time if that need ari=
ses.
Ms.
Moorcroft: I thank the min=
ister
for correcting that information. Is the minister aware whether the current =
list
of deputy judges includes people who are mostly nearing retiring age, or
whether there is a balance of younger and older judges in the list of deputy
judges we currently have on the roster? Hon.
Mr. Nixon: Typically, with the deputy judges, =
they
have retired elsewhere, so in a larger case than not, they are already over=
the
age of 65, but they can practise as a deputy judge until they’re 75 y=
ears
old. Ms.
Moorcroft: During the brea=
k, I
took the opportunity to speak briefly with the minister regarding a proposed
amendment that I will be moving to this bill. The government is often
commenting that they welcome positive suggestions from the opposition and f=
rom
others. As I indicated in my second reading speeches, I would like to sugge=
st
that the minister not be limited in the appointment of deputy judges to
accepting the name of one proposed candidate when there is a need to fill
vacancies or to add more deputy judges to the list. I will be bringing forw=
ard
an amendment to remove the phrase “the name of at least one person who
qualifies for the appointment” and substitute “a list of the na=
mes
of at least four persons who qualify for an appointment, as least two of wh=
om
shall be women”. I notice and I’m pleased to see that there is a
gender balance in the list of names of current qualified deputy judges. It has taken some time to get to th=
at
point. I’m wondering if the minister has had some time to consider wh=
ether
he will in fact be supportive of my proposal to expand the list of names th=
at
are submitted to the minister for consideration when he is appointing deputy
judges. Hon.
Mr. Nixon: In answering the member opposite=
217;s
question, the minimum number of deputy judges’ names is one under the
amendment. There is nothing to prevent me as minister to call for more names
for a deputy judge list from the Judicial Council. So, therefore, Madam Cha=
ir,
I don’t believe the amendment would be necessary. Ms.
Moorcroft: That’s an
interesting argument against what I thought would be a proposal that might =
be
welcomed by the government. If the minister is appointing one judge at a ti=
me
— if the minister is appointing one deputy judge and if the minister =
receives
a list of one name and it’s one woman’s name, and the next time=
he
received only one woman’s name, and the next time he received only one
woman’s name, you might find that there were too many women on the be=
nch
for the public to consider that the court had a gender balance. If I substituted the phrase, “=
;at
least two of whom shall be men,” would the minister then be in suppor=
t of
it or why does he think that this would be an unreasonable approach?=
Hon.
Mr. Nixon: I want to thank the member opposite=
for
her question, but I am just going to restate my final answer. The amendment
that she is bringing forward really is not necessary. If more than one depu=
ty
judge needs to be appointed, then I can do that at that time. So the amendm=
ent,
really, is not necessary. Chair: Is there any further debate? We’re going to proceed with a
clause-by-clause review of Bill No. 37, Act
to Amend the On
Clause 1 Clause
1 agreed to On
Clause 2 Clause
2 agreed to On
Clause 3 Ms.
Moorcroft: Could the minis=
ter
please provide an explanation of what this amendment will do? What will be =
the
result of replacing the expression “judge” with the expression
“judge other than a deputy judge”? Hon.
Mr. Nixon: To put it in plain language, it
streamlines the process for appointing a deputy judge by enabling us to find
someone and appointing them if they are already currently a judge somewhere
else. Chair: Is there any further debate on Clause 3? Clause 3 agreed to On Clause 4 Ms.
Moorcroft: This section do=
es not
clear, actually. As I indicated, I do have an amendment to propose.<=
/p>
Amendment proposed Ms.
Moorcroft: I move <=
/p>
THAT Bill No. 37, entitled Act t=
o Amend
the Territorial Court Act, be amended in clause (4), at page 2, by amen=
ding
section 9(2), removing the phrase “the name of at least one person who
qualifies for the appointment” and substituting for it “a list =
of the
names of at least four persons who qualify for an appointment, at least two=
of
whom shall be women.” While the page is making copies of =
the
amendment for the members — I believe she is distributing them to all
members now — the reasons for this amendment are fairly straightforwa=
rd.
As I indicated, I believe that it would be prudent for the minister to have=
the
ability, when he or she is appointing a deputy judge, to select from a list=
of
names at least one person who qualifies for the appointment. I also believe that it is reasonabl=
e and,
in keeping with the equality provisions of the Canadian Charter of Rights
and Freedoms, that at least half of the names that are considered be wo=
men.
We see throughout the justice system that, by and large, it is male-dominat=
ed.
I believe that the laws and the functioning of the criminal justice system
would improve if there were gender equality throughout the system. It pains=
me
to report that, in fact, many Chair: Is there any debate on the amendment? It has been moved by Ms. Moorcroft =
that
Bill No. 37, entitled Act to Amend the Territorial Court Act, be ame=
nded
in clause (4), at page 2, by amending section 9(2), by removing the phrase
“the name of at least one person who qualifies for the appointment=
221;,
and substituting for it “a list of the names of at least four persons=
who
qualify for an appointment, at least two of whom shall be women.” Are you prepared for the question? =
Are you
agreed? Some
Hon. Member: Division.=
p>
Count Chair: Count has been called. Bells Chair: Would all those in favour please rise? Members rise Chair: Would all those opposed please rise? Members rise Chair: The results are five yea, nine nay. Amendment to Bill No. 37 negativ=
ed Chair: Is there any further debate on clause 4? Clause 4 agreed to On Clause 5 Clause 5 agreed to On Title Title agreed to Hon.
Mr. Nixon: I move that Bill No. 37, entitled <=
i>Act
to Amend the Territorial Court Act, be reported without amendment. Chair: It has been moved by Hon.
Mr. Nixon that Bill No. 37, entitled Act to Amend t=
he
Territorial Court Act, be reported without amendment. Motion agreed to Hon. Mr. Cathers: <=
/span> I move that the Speaker do now resu=
me the
Chair. Chair: <=
span
lang=3DEN-US style=3D'mso-bidi-font-weight:bold'> It has been moved by the =
Government
House Leader that the Speaker do now resume the Chair. Motion
agreed to Speaker
resumes the Chair Speaker: I will now call the House to order. May the House have a report from th=
e Chair
of Committee of the Whole? Chair’s report Ms.
McLeod: Committee of the Whole has consider=
ed
Bill No. 37, Act to Amend the Terri=
torial
Court Act, and directed me to report the bill without amendment.=
Speaker: You have heard the report from the Chair of Committee of the =
Whole.
Are you agreed? Some
Hon. Members: Agreed. Speaker: I declare the report carried. Hon.
Mr. Cathers: Mr. Speaker, I move that the House =
do now
adjourn. Speaker: It has been moved by the Government House Leader that the Hou=
se do
now adjourn. Motion agreed to Speaker: This House stands adjourned until The House adjourned at =
i> The
following Sessional Paper was tabled 33-1-37 Appointments to Major Government Bo=
ards and
Committees, Standing Committee on: 33rd Legislative Assembly, Se=
cond
Report (dated YukonCalgaryAboriginal Sport CircleYukonYukonVictoriaYukon Act — Second Reading Act
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